Author Lindsay Goldwert interviewed Dominatrix’s and learned how to push back when it comes to mixing family, friends and business along with other life lessons. Plus she gifts us with an everyday money tip that will make everyone’s lives richer and more fulfilled.
Lindsay’s Money Story:
Lindsay Goldwert:
So, I keep in touch with some of the doms. They've become friends, they're terrific. And it was funny, one of them was telling me a story about, she teaches a lot of workshops. She's a sex educator. And she had the opportunity to go and teach a class in another city where she had to travel to. And then, she realized they were going to pay her significantly less than what she normally charges for a weekend workshop.
Lindsay Goldwert:
She really wants to do it, but she felt that she had to figure out how she can... She doesn't want to say no, she's such a good person-
Bobbi Rebell:
Right.
Lindsay Goldwert:
And she wants to teach these sorts of things. So she had to figure out how she can teach the class but do it her way so that she didn't feel like her students were short changed. The ones that paid-
Bobbi Rebell:
Right.
Lindsay Goldwert:
Full price.
Bobbi Rebell:
Oh, so she normally charges full price. When she was approached about doing this other thing, is it for a friend? Is it for a relative? And how did she just not mention that she normally gets paid? I mean, do you know what kind of conversation happened to set the situation up and put her in this uncomfortable position?
Lindsay Goldwert:
I think people just reached out to her. The people reach out to her like, "Hey, we'd love to have you. You'd be a great guest. We'd love to have you come teach a class." I don't think people do the research as to how much people charge, that you can't really expect people to know how much you charge. So she had to, it was sort of tough for her to have to come back to them and say, "Actually I charge a lot more."
Lindsay Goldwert:
And I think they were a little surprised, because she does charge a premium for her experience and her services. It was really interesting hearing her talk about how she wants to do it, she wants to share all of her knowledge. But how can she negotiate coming and teaching but doing something a little bit different so that her students wouldn't feel shortchanged, and she could still deliver a nice experience for these other students who are not paying as much.
Lindsay Goldwert:
So she sort of split the baby a little bit by offering them something, which, I think is a very classy thing to do. You know, if someone says, "Oh, can you come over. Can you do my makeup for free?" Or, "Can you do this for free?" One thing you can say is, "No, but I could just do your eyes for you." I once had a friend, she did my makeup, and she said, "I can just do your eyes for that amount of money." And I said, "Deal". And it worked out for her, she got to put in less time. And it worked out for me. Again, I got to do the rest of my makeup myself.
Lindsay Goldwert:
So you have to really figure out what your time is worth, and if you want to expend time with somebody and you want to do them a solid, just be careful how much you're giving, and just tell them that you can only give them a small part of it. Otherwise, it's showing respect for yourself. So it's showing that you're an expert at what you do.
Bobbi Rebell:
Well, and I think it's also respecting the fact that her regular mainstream students, her everyday students that are paying full price, it's valuing that. Because it does, I think it really resonates. It's not just about her, it's about the students. Why should they pay this rate when she's willing to charge so much less for other people. At least she can say, "You're getting my full presentation and everything, and all of my education, they're getting a light version."
Lindsay Goldwert:
Yeah.
Bobbi Rebell:
"A friends and family version, it's different. It's a different product." It's changing the scope.
Lindsay Goldwert:
Yeah.
Bobbi Rebell:
Which is what it's doing, which is something a lot of speakers do. They can say, "I can't do a keynote for that, but I can go, just be on a panel."
Lindsay Goldwert:
Yeah, and I think that's just a really classy way of saying, "I want to work with you. I want to help you. I'm excited to be a part of your community, and this is what I can do that feels true to myself and my brand, and what I charge. And also, I want to be respectful to my students who pay the premium." We all struggle with, what am I worth? What are my services worth? What are other people charging? What if other people are charging less? I found so much of the dom's struggles so similar to mine as a writer.
Bobbi Rebell:
Yeah, because they are entrepreneurs.
Lindsay Goldwert:
They are.
Bobbi Rebell:
At the end of the day. I mean, you went, we'll talk about this more in a minute, but you went to a convention, and they're talking to you about SEO and negotiation, and all the ways that they have to manage their business. Let's first though, I want to just get to what the takeaway is for our listeners. I mean, this almost goes, it reminds me of the, can I just take you out for coffee and pick your brain, for consultants and such.
“A handwritten note is literally the classiest thing you can do”
Lindsay’s Money Lesson:
Lindsay Goldwert:
I really don't like that. It's one thing, if you have to seek someone's advice for free, they should be a good friend, they should never be a stranger. And if, for some reason, you have a lot of charm and they write you back, come to them and buy them coffee. Make it as easy for them as possible. Don't ask them to meet you in the city, someplace that's close to you. Just literally go to a block from their house. Keep it to half an hour or an hour, and come with your questions in hand. Or else just say, "Can I have you for 15 minutes on the phone?" People are very busy and they're not getting anything out of talking to you. Not that everything has to be so transactional.
Lindsay Goldwert:
And if it's a friend, it's different. I will give my friends my time because they give me lots of love and support, so it's all okay. But everyone's looking for a mentor, but don't force your desire for a mentor onto them.
Bobbi Rebell:
Yeah, it's a case-by-case basis, and I do get approached by a lot of people that want to "pick my brain", and what I do is I do set aside a chunk of time once a week where I'll take these appointments. They have to come to me, and I'll talk to people briefly, but it's absolutely important to be respectful. You don't have to hire everybody as a consultant just to get a little bit of time with them, but understand that that time is valuable. I think is important.
Lindsay Goldwert:
It really is. And it's a lot of effort to meet someone and have to listen to their story. Whatever you can do to make it easiest for somebody. I tell that to journalism students all the time. I say, "If you want someone to talk to you for an article, even email them, be as gracious as you can. Be very brief." But say, "I saw that you wrote this article or that you're an expert on this subject. I have three questions, here's what they are." And just be very gracious and complimentary, people love to be complimented. But just show you did your homework and make it easy for them as possible.
Bobbi Rebell:
It's all about valuing their time, which goes back to your money story. And it also feeds into your everyday money tip, which I have experienced and it's just so lovely. What is your everyday money tip?
“I don’t trust people with easy answers”
Lindsay’s Money Tip:
Lindsay Goldwert:
My everyday money tip is to always send a thank you note. I know that seems sort of strange, like, how is that a money tip? But every time, I have followed up with a handwritten card or a handwritten email every time someone has interviewed me, every time someone has done something nice for me, and every time someone's given me a little bit of advice over coffee. Even if it's a friend, I always write back and I always, even if it's a text, I always write back and say thank you. And people don't get thank yous very often. If someone does you a real solid, makes an introduction for you, or just goes a little bit above and beyond, you send a gift. And I know gifts can be expensive, but it is the thought that counts.
Lindsay Goldwert:
People think, "Oh, what if your thoughts are cheap?" But it is the thought that counts. My friend sent me, when the book came out, a friend of mine sent me some bath oil, and it was just the most thoughtful thing. A handwritten note is literally the classiest thing you can do. And if you don't have time for that, an email or a text. And don't you just use emojis, just really write out the words, write out the words.
Bobbi Rebell:
Yeah. No, I do think that's so valuable. And I have been on the receiving end of some of your lovely gifts, and they make all the difference. It's really lovely to, a few days after whatever happened, in this case you came to a brunch and we had a great time. And getting a followup gift from somebody is so lovely and so thoughtful and really, it cements a friendship in some ways, and it really shows that you appreciate each other. And it goes a long way. And then, also just, I think, being considerate, going forward, of that person. It's just, just being a friend is worth its weight in gold.
Lindsay Goldwert:
I mean we just think that because of LinkedIn that a connection is just a connection, that's what people do. And the answer is no, people are putting their own reputations on the line when they introduce you to somebody. So it's not just, hang out with my friend or talk to my friend. It's like, no, if my friend turns out to be a lousy person, then you're going to think I'm a lousy person. So having somebody vouch for you is a gift. And a gift should be returned with a gift.
Bobbi Rebell:
Yes. Well, I think that's lovely.
“I don’t think people do the research as to how much people charge. You can’t really expect people to know how much you charge.”
Bobbi’s Financial Grownup Tips:
Financial Grownup Tip #1:
I love what Lindsay had to say about sending thank yous. It's something I've been trying to get better at, frankly. If it's not in your budget to send an actual physical gift, one option, and I've used this, is to send a personalized really nice eCard. I've recently been using Paperless Post. I'm sure there's other services you can use as well. And specifically not sending group thank yous. I make each one out to just one person with a specific and detailed personal note, and yes, I even use those extra coins, as they call their currency, to pick fun backgrounds and envelope liners and extra touches. They are simple, affordable and fun, and you can see when they opened it so you know that it didn't get lost in the mail.
Financial Grownup Tip #2:
When you book friends and family appointments, make sure that there is a specific start and end time, and let them know about it. Be disciplined, send a calendar note. And don't be afraid if it is, for example, a phone call, to just do 15 minutes. And make sure to be on time on either end, even if you're the one helping. Be respectful of their time so they understand that it's appreciated, that you're respectful of theirs.
I use a service called Calendly. There's many different ones that you can use out there, but that's how I set up my interview appointments. And I have it preset with extra time before and after, so I have extra pad time so I don't have back-to-back appointments. So if I run late for one, I'm still on time for the next one. I should say if one goes over, if it goes too long. I also keep a to-do list nearby, of easy tasks that are small, that I can do quickly. So if I have a few minutes in between I can be productive if I'm feeling focused and want to check something off my to-do list. And it's okay by the way, also, to take a break in those times if you need it. So definitely build in that pad time between appointments. Keep those appointments tight though.
Episode Links:
Lindsay's website - www.lindsaygoldwert.com
Lindsays’s podcast - Spent
Lindsay’s book - Bow Down
Follow Lindsay!
Instagram - @lindsay_goldwert
Twitter - @lindsaygoldwert
LinkedIn
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