Erin Lowry, author of Broke Millennial Takes on Investing thought her new hubby was all set when he assured her he had bought life insurance to protect his parents obligation to his student debt. But a chance discovery revealed the insurance was not what either of them thought he had purchased. 

In Erin's money story you will learn:

• Erin is a newlywed - Congrats again Erin!!

• Her husband had a huge amount of student debt that his parents had co-signed for

• She suggested that he get life insurance so that, in the unfortunate event that he were to lose his life, the debt wouldn't pass to his parents

• She found out that the life insurance he got was Whole Life insurance instead of Term Life insurance

• Why Whole Life Insurance wasn't the best for him

• The difference between Whole Life Insurance and Term Life Insurance

In Erin’s money lesson you will learn:

• Fiduciary means they are required to act in the best interest of you. Suitability means they just can’t do anything that is harmful to you.

• Her husband was sold a product that wasn't the best fit for him

In Erin's everyday money tip you will learn:

• When she receives change back from a purchase, she saves the $5 bills. In 2018 she saved over $1000 to use towards her honeymoon

In My Take you will learn:

• There’s a lot of financial jargon out there. If you are making a financial decision, make sure you take the time to look up the words you don’t understand.

• I’ve been talking a lot recently about what I call the Family Ecosystem. You are not just responsible for yourself, even if you are single.

Episode Links:

• Erin's new book Broke Millennial Takes On Investing: A Beginner's Guide to Leveling Up Your Money

• Erin's first book Broke Millennial: Stop Scraping By and Get Your Financial Life Together

Check out Erin's website -

www.BrokeMillennial.com

Follow Erin!

• Instagram - @BrokeMillennialBlog

• Pinterest - @BrokeMillennial

• Twitter - @BrokeMillennial

• Facebook - @BrokeMillennial

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Transcription

Erin Lowry:
My editor wrote me back and said, "Hey, this amount seems pretty high for a mid 20-something who's healthy." And I thought, "You know what? You're right." Then it dawned on me, "Uh-oh, he probably got a whole life insurance policy."

Bobbi Rebell:
You're listening to you Financial Grownup with me, certified financial planner, Bobbi Rebell, author of How to Be a Financial Grownup, and you know what? Being a grown up is really hard, especially when it comes to money, but it's okay. We're going to get there together. I'm going to bring you one money story from a financial grownup, one lesson and then my take on how you can make it your own. We got this.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hello Financial Grownup friends. Have you ever had a conversation with someone that in your mind was totally straight forward? The conversation was totally straight forward with no room for error or misunderstanding, super clear and clear to them, they said they got it, but there was one deal once you didn't realize you had been silent to and they didn't know to ask about and that caused things to go very wrong? Well, it happened to newlywed author, Erin Lowry, and it serves as a real warning to all of us because it can happen to a money expert and her new husband.

Bobbi Rebell:
Welcome, by the way, and thanks for joining us, new listeners, so glad you have found us. DM me if you have a sec, bobbirebell1 on Instagram, Bobbi Rebell on Twitter and let me know how you discovered the show and what you would like to hear. We do this for you. Let's get to our guest. Her new book is Broke Millennial Takes On Investing, which after you hear more about it will definitely be something you want to pick up. Here is Erin Lowry.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey, Erin Lowry, you're a financial grownup. Welcome to the podcast.

Erin Lowry:
Thanks for having me.

Bobbi Rebell:
I'm so excited. I've been waiting to have you on my show for over a year and we said we're going to wait and hold off until your next book comes out and it's happening. It is Broke Millennial Takes On Investing and people should know this. This is a followup to your first book, Broke Millennial, and there's actually going to be a third one, which is pretty unheard of to do like a three ... Do we call it a hat trick to get a three book deal? That's pretty amazing. So congratulations on all.

Erin Lowry:
Thank you.

Bobbi Rebell:
We're going to talk more about Broke Millennial Takes On Investing, but first we're going to do your money story. You're a newlywed. Congratulations on your wedding and that comes with merging finances and you start to learn about the love of your life in different ways. In this case you learned that your now husband did the right thing, but made the wrong choice in a big financial decision and it just shows how complicated things are. It had to do with student loans and insurance. Tell us the story.

Erin Lowry:
It also shows that when you give somebody advice they take it sometimes, but don't take it in the way that you intended, which was a big part of what happened here. And for context, my husband, whom I call Peach, he has student loans. When this whole thing went down, first of all, it was not an insignificant amount. I don't really share his number, but it was a hefty chunk of change.

Bobbi Rebell:
And we're talking about student debt?

Erin Lowry:
Student loan debt. Yep. And a big chunk of those student loans were private student loans that his parents had cosigned on, which meant that if something happened to him, his parents would still be responsible for paying off those loans and by something happening, I mean, if he died, and the debt was still there. His parents would still be required to pay off that student loan debt. Now, I want to say right now, some companies have changed their policies and started to discharging debt and most federal student loans can be discharged in death, but not necessarily the case with private.

Erin Lowry:
After we have this conversation, this was a few years before we got married, I said, "I think it would be prudent for you to get a life insurance policy on yourself because seriously having forbid something happen, your parents are still on the hook for a lot of money and that could really impact their ability to retire. So you should have a life insurance policy that has them as the beneficiaries."

Bobbi Rebell:
Right. And the good news is he took your advice.

Erin Lowry:
He did. And I just kind of said it. I wasn't even necessarily like, "Go do this right now." He went and got a life insurance policy and a few months later I was actually writing an article on life insurance and I interviewed him for it. He told me how much he was paying every month and what the payout would be. And I wrote the article up and my editor wrote me back and said, "Hey, this amount seems pretty high for a mid 20-something who's healthy."

Erin Lowry:
I thought, "You know what? You're right." And then it dawned on me, "Uh-oh, he probably got a whole life insurance policy." So I go back and I went, "Hey babe, what kind of life insurance policy did you get?"

Bobbi Rebell:
"Hey babe, let's talk life insurance tonight?"

Erin Lowry:
So sexy. It's such a great topic. He had indeed gotten a whole life insurance policy and I tried not to get any sort of aggressive about it. He was like, "Why?"

Bobbi Rebell:
He's like, "Aren't you proud of me? I went out and got life insurance just like you said," and he had actually talked to somebody. He didn't even go out blindly and just kind of buy it ... I don't even know if you can literally just buy it on the web. There's obviously a step that you have to take. But he did proactively talk to somebody about it and get "advice" and I put advice in quotation marks.

Erin Lowry:
And that was where the problem was, is the person that he talked to was essentially pitching him a product, and listen, the pitch on whole life insurance is great. It does sound really good, I get it. But on the backend, this salesperson, and I'm going to call them a salesperson also probably got a commission for signing him up for whole life insurance. This is a fiduciary versus suitability conversation. Fiduciary meaning it's in your best interest. Suitability, just meaning it's suitable for you. Whole life is suitable for him, but it certainly wasn't the best product for him, what his needs were and what his age was.

Erin Lowry:
Even what it is now, it doesn't make sense for him.

Bobbi Rebell:
Could you explain a little bit about why? Why was whole life insurance not right for him and how is that different from term life, which is what was appropriate for him.

Erin Lowry:
Without getting into the weeds on technicalities, a big part of it really is one, the monthly premium that you're paying on a whole life insurance policy is usually significantly more expensive than term. Significant can be kind of a subjective term, but he was at the time in his mid 20s trying to pay off student loans, living in New York City and he's a public school teacher. So $25.50 a month in his budget does make a really big difference.

Erin Lowry:
That was thing one and two term life insurance is usually much lower monthly payments, typically a higher payout. It's just for a shorter period of time and it's a use it or lose it policy. So if you stay alive, which "Yay! You stay alive," and don't use it, the policy eventually just expires. So some people don't like this feeling of, "Well, I never see a return on my money," but that's true. Really most insurances that we pay for, if you have auto insurance and never get in a car accident, yay, you didn't get in a car accident, but also what were you paying for? You we're just paying for the protection.

Bobbi Rebell:
Right, so term life does not have an investment component and therefore when the term is over, if you do not use it, which we hope we don't use it, there is nothing left. There's no benefit at all. You have just spent the money and the money that you spent on those premiums is gone, but it is less money.

Erin Lowry:
It's less money. You can be putting the money that you're not spending towards other financial goals and or investments. The other thing you've got to think about is does this particular product make the most sense for you? Whole life insurance does make sense for some people. It didn't make sense for him at the time. Maybe way down the line it will make more sense, but right now all he needed was a basic simple term life insurance policy.

Bobbi Rebell:
What finally happened?

Erin Lowry:
He called the folks back up that had sold him the whole life insurance policy and said, "Hey, this isn't actually what I wanted. I want a term policy." The woman tried to talk him into staying with the whole, he was adamant-

Bobbi Rebell:
No. Oh, I hate that.

Erin Lowry:
Yep. So there was a back and forth, but he was adamant about switching to term. He switched to term, has a really basic policy. Now that we're married, actually we have to have a whole other conversation about life insurance as well in our own estate planning, but he still does have that policy because those student loans still do exist. We're working on getting rid of them and his parents are still the beneficiary because again, if something happened to him, even though he and I are married, if something happens to him, his parents would still be on the hook for those particular student loans. They didn't transfer it to me in our marriage.

Bobbi Rebell:
And he was able to get out of the whole life insurance policy? He wasn't locked in?

Erin Lowry:
He wasn't locked in. He was able to switch.

Bobbi Rebell:
That's great.

Erin Lowry:
Yeah, it's the same company actually. He didn't switch companies, but he did completely switch policies.

Bobbi Rebell:
What is the lesson for our listeners? It sounds like they really need to understand fiduciary versus a salesperson.

Erin Lowry:
The big thing is understanding fiduciary versus suitability. And for me, I also use this story in my book to talk about sniffing out a scam. I don't want to say he was necessarily scammed in the way that we traditionally think, especially when we think about investing, but he was definitely sold a product that wasn't the best fit for him. And I want you to consider that anytime you're working with any sort of professional, because they don't necessarily have your ultimate best interest in mind, they might also have their bank account in mind and you need to know how that person is getting paid.

Erin Lowry:
For instance, if you're a financial adviser gets paid on commission, you need to understand how that's going to be impacting your overall portfolio. What products are they putting in there that they get a kickback for? Now, I'm not saying everybody that takes commission is working in any sort of nefarious ways, but I am saying you need to make sure you understand exactly what that means for you and your investments. And again, fiduciary means they are required to act in the best interest of you. Suitability means they just can't do anything that's harmful to you.

Bobbi Rebell:
All right, let's talk about your everyday money tip. It's something you really do and it has made a big difference in your life.

Erin Lowry:
Yes, and this is going to sound so silly to people, but I like to save $5 bills, and I know a lot of people don't use cash anymore. I still do like to use cash and every single time I get a $5 bill back when I pay for something in cash, I put it inside in a little jar and just let that money accumulate. And then eventually I put it all in my bank account. And in 2018, I saved over a thousand dollars to put towards my honeymoon fund account just with this tiny little trick.

Bobbi Rebell:
Love that. So let's just talk briefly about your latest book, number two, out of your three book series, Broke Millennial Takes On Investing. Tell us more about what sets this apart and the kind of advice that people could expect from the book?

Erin Lowry:
This is a true beginners guide to investing and that's the way I like to position it. Also, I'm not an investing expert. What I like to consider myself in this book is a translator. So I went out and interviewed a bunch of very, very smart, very experienced people and was able to distill this into a more digestible package. But the reason I wrote the book is because, listen, there are great investing books out there, but a lot of them do kind of operate under the assumption that you have some base level knowledge when it comes to investing. And frankly, most of us don't when we're just getting started.

Erin Lowry:
So I wanted to write a book that bridged the gap. It assumes that you have no background in investing, no base level knowledge and if you do, great, there's still content for you, but you don't need to know what asset allocation or index funds are or time horizon means or anything like that in order to pick up my book. It also really talks a lot about the emotional side of investing and how to kind of get control over that because a lot of us do fear and are intimidated by the market.

Bobbi Rebell:
And I love the fact that you actually have a ton of just plain definitions in the book.

Erin Lowry:
Yes. There's a whole chapter about having this sort of baseline understanding of terminology and I even kind of apologize and the beginning of, "Hey, I know this is about to get real technical bear with me," but it's important that you understand the language because these are the terms you're going to hear when you're out there as an investor and you want to make sure you know what people are talking about.

Bobbi Rebell:
Yes. And never be afraid to ask a question that you "think is dumb," because there've been times I've asked questions that I'm embarrassed to ask and you know what? The person I'm asking doesn't actually know the answer. They're kind of faking their way through it, so don't fake it and pretend you understand something when you don't. It's okay. Ask the questions or look it up in Erin's book. There you go.

Erin Lowry:
That was actually one of my favorite parts of writing this book is learning terms and like, "Oh, that's what a basis [inaudible 00:12:22] is." It really wasn't helpful.

Bobbi Rebell:
A lot of people gloss over those things and don't actually know what they mean. You would be surprised. Just say. Great. Give us all your socials and where people can find out more about the book and you.

Erin Lowry:
I am on Instagram @brokemillennialblog, on Twitter @BrokeMillennial, Facebook the same. You can find a lot of information about me on my website, brokemillennial.com, and both my first and second books are available wherever books are sold. Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Powell's, Indie books, hopefully your local bookstore and I always like to make a plug for your local library and if it's not there, please request it and get it on the shelf.

Bobbi Rebell:
And make sure everyone follow her on Instagram. She does great AMA, so that's one of my favorite parts of all of your social. So thank you Erin.

Erin Lowry:
Thank you so much for having me.

Bobbi Rebell:
Okay, my friends. Let's do this. Financial Grownup tip number one. There's a lot of financial jargon out there. Erin talks about it a lot. If you are making a financial decision, make sure you take the time to look up the words you don't understand. I get it. It can be embarrassing to ask someone something you think you should know, but by the way, a lot of times those people are nodding along pretending they fully get it and they may not or they may think they get it and they don't really know the questions to ask.

Bobbi Rebell:
As was the case with Erin's husband where he didn't know to ask exactly what kind of life insurance because he didn't know and he certainly wasn't educated by the salesperson what to ask and what the nuance differences are between different kinds of life insurance. So Erin has a lot of definitions in her book, but you can also check out websites for example, I like a website called Investopedia. It breaks down exactly what things really mean. Takes away the jargon.

Bobbi Rebell:
As I often say, the IRS website. Yes, the irs.gov website is also great at clarifying how certain things work. You forget about this, but a lot of the savings vehicles and retirement plans that we have are named after their tax code, like the 401k or the 529. Those numbers, that's the meaning of the numbers. They're actually part of the tax code. I know it's kind of crazy, but that's our system.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial grownup tip number two. I've been talking a lot recently about what I call, the family ecosystem. You're not just responsible for yourself if you're going to be a financial grownup. Even if you're single, you likely have financial ties to members of your family you may not even realize. For example, you may be with somebody who's your partner. They may have ties that both of you aren't fully aware of in terms of top of mind. If you really think about it, you are and that's what I'm asking you to do, but it may not be the first thing you think of.

Bobbi Rebell:
You think of yourself as just single. It could be something like in the case of Erin's new husband, co-signing on debt of some sorts, student debt in that case. Maybe it's a car loan or even a mortgage or maybe you and your siblings could find yourselves in the future caring for parents or another member of the older generation and you have financial responsibilities. You may need to pick up the pieces of something that they did not do.

Bobbi Rebell:
Maybe they didn't save enough for retirement. This could be something that you get involved with. Maybe you'll inherit something with your siblings. The point is make sure that you know and that you talk about it with anyone that's a stakeholder. Erin didn't cosign her husband's student debt, but she is definitely a stake holder. Thanks so much for spending this time with us. Please subscribe. We have an amazing spring lineup of guests you don't want to miss, and we are also doing some listener requested topics on the Financial Grownup guide series that we roll out on the weekends. So feel free to send in suggestions on the socials.

Bobbi Rebell:
You can DM me at Instagram @bobbirebell1, on Twitter @bobbirebell and our email is hello@financialgrownup.com. Big thanks to Broke Millennial, Erin Lowry, for helping us all get one step closer to being financial grownups.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownup with Bobby Rebell is edited and produced by Steve Stewart and is a BRK Media production.

Bobbi reveals her favorite new money related books, and how to decide if they are right for you. This month’s picks include Melissa Leong's Happy Go Money, Student Loan Solution by David Carlson, Nathan Latka’s How to be a Capitalist without any Capital, Women with Money by Jean Chatzky and Work Wife by Erica Cerulo and Claire Mazur.

Here are 5 money books that I truly enjoyed

• Happy Go Money by Melissa Leong

  • Melissa's Financial Grownup episode

• Student Loan Solution by David Carlson

  • David's Financial Grownup episode

• How to be a Capitalist without any Capital by Nathan Latka

  • Nathan's Financial Grownup episode

• Women with Money by Jean Chatzky

  • Jean's Classic Financial Grownup episode

  • Jean's Financial Grownup Guide episode

• Work Wife by Erica Cerulo and Claire Mazur

  • Erica Cerulo and Claire Mazur's Financial Grownup episode

Be sure to listen to the episode to learn if the book is for you or not

Episode Links:

• Melissa's website - www.MelissaLeong.com

• David's website - www.YoungAdultMoney.com

• Nathan's website - www.NathanLatka.com

• Jean's website - www.JeanChatzky.com

• Erica Cerulo and Claire Mazur's website - www.OfAKinda.com

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

The bosses behind design website "Of a Kind", the podcast “A Few Things” and the new book “Work Wife” share their experience finally being offered the investor funding they fought for-  and then walking away from the deal. Plus a preview of their new book “Work Wives".

In Erica and Claire's money story you will learn:

• They started trying to raise money when they started their retail business in 2010

• Their business, Of A Kind, is an e-commerce site that is focused primarily fashion and design

• How they were finally able to get some money In 2013 for their business

• Why Claire and Erica didn't like the terms of the agreement.

• How they finally decided that the money wasn't what they wanted after all

In Erica and Claire’s money lesson you will learn:

• Why it's so important to listen to your gut. If it's something you thought you wanted but then decided it wasn't, it's okay to change your mind and walk away

• Why what they thought they wanted would only bring new and different problems

In Erica and Claire's everyday money tip you will learn:

• Why Erica feels strongly about having multiple accounts that have money automatically being put into each account

• When Claire and her husband combined finances they both started taking the same percentage of their paychecks to contribute to shared account.

In My Take you will learn:

• How the benefits of friendships in business can also be platonic relationships between the opposite sex

• Why it's important to read all the paperwork like Erica and Claire did

Episode Links:

Erica and Claire's book Work Wife

Check out Erica and Claire's website -

www.OfAKinda.com

Follow Erica and Claire!

• Instagram - @OfAKind

• LinkedIn - @OfAKind

• Pinterest - @OfAKind

• Twitter - @OfAKind

• Facebook - @OfAKind

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Transcription

Claire Mazur:
For so long we had just been trying to get anybody to say that yes, they would give us money, and I don't think we'd really considered that we might not want to take it when somebody finally offered it to us.

Erica Cerulo:
We didn't want all of the strings that came with this money. They wanted too much of the company, they wanted to be very involved in the day to day. One of the investors wanted to be in the office I think up to two full days a week.

Bobbi Rebell:
You're listening to Financial Grownup with me, certified financial planner Bobbi Rebell, author of How to Be a Financial Grownup. But you know what? Being a grownup is really hard especially when it comes to money, but it's okay, we're gonna get there together. I'm gonna bring you one money story from a financial grown up, one lesson, and then my take on how you can make it your own. We got this.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey friends. So when someone offers you the money, maybe for a business you've been building, that you've been asking for, begging for, searching for, for so long, and you finally get that offer. Well, it's a pretty good bet you'll say, "Thank you." And cash that check. But what if you have a bad gut feeling? What if there are things in the terms that you didn't really think would bother you, but then they really do? Nothing's ever free, and an investor money always comes with some strings. It's just a question of how tied up you're willing to be in those strings. And like many big life decisions, we often don't know until we are there.

Bobbi Rebell:
Welcome everyone. New listeners, thank you for checking out the podcast. We bring you high achievers who share money stories that had big impacts on their lives, along with the lessons that they have learned, so we all get to benefit from their experiences. Today we are doing something extra special. We have two guests, Erica Cerulo and Claire Mazur. You may already know their design website Of a Kind and their podcast A Few Things, and most recently their best selling, newly released book Work Wife, appropriately titled because these best friends are just that. And that friendship proved priceless when they had to make a key decision for their business in its startup time in search of cash. Here are Erica Cerulo and Claire Mazur.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey Erica Cerulo and Claire Mazur. You guys are financial grownups. Welcome to the podcasts.

Claire Mazur:
Thank you so much.

Erica Cerulo:
Thank you so much.

Bobbi Rebell:
I love that. Said in unison.

Erica Cerulo:
Exactly.

Bobbi Rebell:
Perfect.

Erica Cerulo:
That's very us.

Bobbi Rebell:
Very you. You guys are work wives. I'm gonna ask you to each say hi and say your names so everybody knows which voice is which of you.

Claire Mazur:
This is Claire Mazur, and I hope that this introduction helps people distinguish us because we're told all the time that our voices sound exactly alike.

Erica Cerulo:
At least on a podcast. This is Erica Cerulo.

Bobbi Rebell:
Awesome. You guys are on in part to talk about, we have a great money story and all those good things, but congratulations on your latest together project appropriately titled Work Wife, and I should tell everyone this comes after other things which include a business called Of A Kind, which you still control, we can talk about how that's become a bigger venture, a podcast called A Few Things which I am a new and very dedicated fan of, and a newsletter called 10 things. So there's a lot going on guys.

Claire Mazur:
Yeah. We have been at this not for over nine years, and the business has been around for eight years and some change, and we just keep adding on new projects.

Bobbi Rebell:
You guys met in college, I should said?

Erica Cerulo:
Yes. It was when I was 19 and Claire was 18. So still teenagers.

Bobbi Rebell:
You guys have a long history together, and that helps you deal with what we're gonna talk about as your money story, which was kind of a tough situation as young business women. Tell us your money story.

Claire Mazur:
We were a couple of years into the business, we had been trying to raise money, kind of the entire life of the business at that point. We started the business in 2010, which was a time of very frothy VC funding. It seemed like left, right and center, everybody was raising a million dollars or more very easily, and we had been struggling to do that, I think in part because we had a more traditional retail business than a lot of the [crosstalk 00:04:12].

Bobbi Rebell:
Explain what Of A Kind is actually for people that don't know.

Claire Mazur:
Yeah, absolutely. So Of A Kind is an e-commerce site. We are primarily fashion and design, so we sell clothes, accessories, jewelry, also personal care and paper goods from emerging designers, primarily in the United States. So it's really based on discovery and Erica and my love of discovering new designers and new makers, and telling the story behind the pieces. So we have a very party content arm to the business and we have since day one always told the story of all of the makers whose pieces are on the site.

Bobbi Rebell:
Okay. So you guys go to raise money and the good news is there is a lot of money out there.

Claire Mazur:
Yeah.

Erica Cerulo:
And the bad news is we were really bad at raising it.

Claire Mazur:
Exactly.

Bobbi Rebell:
But you did have opportunity to get funded.

Erica Cerulo:
We did. In about 2012 or 2013 we had gone out to investors and had conversations with a few angel investors who were very enthusiastic about our business and made us an, put a deal sheet in front of us, a term sheet in front of us, and what we were aiming for this whole time, right? To raise funding, to be able to grow the business more aggressively, and to pursue marketing and other growth opportunities that we hadn't been able to pursue to date because we were really scrappy and cash strapped.

Erica Cerulo:
In looking at their term sheet and in thinking about what this would mean for the business, we came to this realization that we didn't want the terms. We didn't want all of the strings that came with this money. They wanted too much of the company, they wanted to be very involved in the day to day. One of the investors wanted to be in the office at least one full day a week, I think up to two full days a week, and while we valued their input, we didn't want them to be involved in the business in that capacity.

Erica Cerulo:
So we were sort of in this place where we were like, well what do we do here? This is what we thought we wanted, but here we are and it's not what we want.

Claire Mazur:
It took a minute for us to really get there because for so long we had just been trying to get anybody to say that yes, they would give us money. And I don't think we'd really considered that we might not want to take it when somebody finally offered it to us. And really, the options at that point were to walk away, to try to find money from somebody else, or to take the leap and say, okay, we're gonna take the money and hope it goes well. And what we realized, and what we were really fortunate to be able to do at that point was we had just started to be cash flow positive. So we were able to say no to them because we realized, okay, if we were cash flow positive last month we know we can do it again next month, and we know we can continue to just sort of put money back into the business. And we were able to pull together a little bit of friends and family funding to close the delta, because obviously we weren't making as much money as these investors were offering us. But it felt like absolutely the right decision at the time.

Claire Mazur:
It was a while ago, but I can't even remember how much discussion went into it. I think we really knew at the end of the day, especially when we got that report from our accountants that showed us how much money we were making we were like, okay, this is the right decision.

Erica Cerulo:
I also, I remember having the conversation, we were in South by Southwest, we were sitting in the Airbnb that we were renting, and basically coming to the realization that this wasn't money that we wanted, and that we would find another way, and that the thing that would impact the business at that point most, more than having those significantly bigger marketing budget or more than having the other things that we really wanted to be able to spend this money on was another head count and being able to at higher, I think at this point it woulda been our second employee so it woulda been Claire and I, we had a third employee, and this would be our sort of fourth person on the team. And that, that would allow Claire and I to be able to focus more on some of the bigger picture things that we weren't really able to think about at that point. And that, that could be the difference in the future of the company maybe more than the money would.

Bobbi Rebell:
And what was the conversation like? Did you just say, we're not gonna do this and walk away? Or was there an attempt to negotiate?

Erica Cerulo:
We had definitely attempted to negotiate with them for sure. And those were all sort of conversations leading up to this point. But this was just sort of where they had firmly come down and said, no, this is what it would need to be for us to be involved. And so it was sort of like the final offering that we were walking away from.

Bobbi Rebell:
How did you guys feel? What was your private conversation like at this point?

Claire Mazur:
I think we felt really triumphant in a way. It was honestly one of the best feelings we'd had about the business up to that point because it wasn't just that we had done what we knew was the right thing and was frankly kind of the hard thing, but we were able to do it because we had some success in the business. And that empowerment was really thrilling for us.

Bobbi Rebell:
So what is the lesson for our listeners from that story?

Claire Mazur:
There are several, but I think the one for me is to listen to your gut. And to know that just because something is something you thought you wanted, if it doesn't feel right it's probably not right.

Erica Cerulo:
It demonstrated to us that with money there come trade offs. We thought this was the answer to our questions and the answer to our problems and we realized that actually this would introduce new and different problems.

Bobbi Rebell:
Interesting. It is complicated. And people think that something, that's kind of a metaphor for bigger statement that people do think that money is going to be the answer to so many things in life. And it's really not. It sometimes just leads to different challenges.

Erica Cerulo:
Exactly.

Bobbi Rebell:
Speaking of challenges, let's give everyone solutions. Let's talk about everyday money tips.

Erica Cerulo:
Well, basically my money solution is that feel strongly about having multiple different accounts that I'm automatically putting a percentage of each paycheck into. So I know that one account is for savings, and I don't touch it. And a percentage of my income just gets dropped there. Another account is for day to day necessities like rent and groceries and those things that are sort of fixed costs and that I can budget toward. And the third is sort of a slush fund and that's where dinners out and shoes or whatever else come from. And I think it's nice for me to know that, that particular account is just sort of a play fund. It is for me to do with what I do. And so I don't set a firm budget around dining out or entertainment or any of those things, but I know that I have this fixed amount of money to play with for all of those things combined.

Bobbi Rebell:
So broader categories. And Claire, sticking to the theme of bank accounts, you also have an everyday money tip.

Claire Mazur:
Yeah. So when it came time for my husband and I to combine finances we used something that I know I learned from somebody else, and I think it might have been from Suze Orman, but we basically, no matter how much either of us is making, and obviously that number changes and has changed over the years, we both take the same percentage of our paycheck and contribute it to a shared amount. And then whatever's remaining we each have in our individual accounts. And we both have really different spending habits and that has made our lives so much easier when it comes to dealing with shared expenses and not shared expenses. So I never worry about if he's going to judge me for buying clothes or expensive tickets somewhere or whatever or a fancy gift for a friend of mine whose not his friend, he doesn't have to worry about it, he knows it's coming from my private account.

Claire Mazur:
And when it comes to our shared account it's so much easier to have these conversations about how and what we're spending on because we know that these are shared expenses and we're making those decisions together. And I never have to worry about if he's spending his money in a way that I approve of or don't approve of. And I think that has eliminated so much potential tension from our lives.

Bobbi Rebell:
Yeah, it's about communicating when you need to and also giving yourselves permission not to communicate on some things because you don't need to and that can be a relief as well. You guys communicate pretty well as work wives so much so that you've written a book. And this is becoming a whole buzz word in the community these days. I don't think we realize how many big companies have been led by these female power house teams. Tell us a little bit more.

Claire Mazur:
Erica and I had been business partners for nine years now and friends for 17 years?

Erica Cerulo:
Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Claire Mazur:
And had always known that we were very proud of our partnership and had always taken that really seriously. In fact, when we were fundraising we would often hear from investors, they would say, I think I'm gonna pass, it's not right for me, but I gotta tell you, I'm really impressed by your partnership. And I remember that really sticking with us and being like, oh, I think what we have here is unique. And it is unique, but what we realized in looking around was that there are a ton of other women doing this. And there are a ton of women who are really benefiting from this sort of basic tenants of female friendship like emotional intimacy and vulnerability and transparency in a business environment. So what we did for the book is we interviewed 14 other duos and trios of women about what their partnerships look like and what the friendships underneath those partnerships look like.

Claire Mazur:
And what we came with was this really strong belief in the power of female friendship to drive successful businesses and this understanding that when you value female friendship in the workplace you start to see other characteristics contributing to corporate culture that weren't there before. So these ideas of vulnerability in the workplace become a much bigger facet, and that can really change corporate culture ultimately.

Bobbi Rebell:
And I think it's important to understand a lot of these relationships did not start on day one. Some did, but most did not start on day one with, let's just meet as strangers and start a business. There's usually a history and a bond before that. And a lot of work that goes into preparing to go into business together. I mean, one of the tips that you give that I think makes so much sense is to do something like take a trip together and see how you react when something doesn't go as planned. Because these are complicated relationships. 'Cause they're real friendships but they're real businesses.

Erica Cerulo:
That's exactly right. That's exactly right. And that's a piece of advice that Haley [Barna 00:13:54] who is one of the founders of BirchBox and is now a venture capitalist gave for potential business partners or potential work wives who don't have that previous experience of working together, who maybe were friends first and haven't been in an office together and aren't 100% sure of how the other interacts in super stressful situations in a work environment.

Bobbi Rebell:
I'm gonna give you the last word Claire.

Claire Mazur:
We are so excited about the book and we hope that it spreads the idea of friendship in the workplace, not just for women but for men too. We think it's really important to think about the way that personal and the professional mesh with each other in that way.

Bobbi Rebell:
Let's wrap it up with you can just tell us where we can out more about you guys, your book Work Wife, your business Of a Kind, your podcast A Few Things, your newsletter Ten Things, and everything else. I feel like you guys have a lot more in your back pocket that we're gonna be hearing from you soon.

Erica Cerulo:
You can find it on our website ofakind.com where you can also buy the book Work Wife or you can buy it any place books are sold. You can find us on Instagram, @ofakind, and the book, @workwifehq and yeah.

Bobbi Rebell:
Erica Cerulo, Claire Mazur, thank you so much. This was amazing.

Claire Mazur:
Thank you so much.

Erica Cerulo:
Thank you so much Bobbi, have a great day.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey everyone. Let's talk about work besties. Financial Grownup tip number one, Erica and Claire's book is focused on female friendship and business partnership and has a lot of specifics that are unique to women, combining business and friendship that both women and men can learn a lot from. But I also wanna add that while the relationships are absolutely different there can also be a lot of value in work husbands or work wife relationships of opposite sexes. And just to confirm, we are talking platonic here. That can also be really supportive at work. Add to that what I would call your work squad which can mean a group of work friends that can be supportive and be true friends, business partners, and industry allies.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownup tip number two, read all that paperwork. It's boring but you have to do it. Erica and Claire did it. They thought they had the deal they really wanted. But then, when they took the time, and thankfully they did, to read all the terms, not just how much money they were getting, read past the headline my friends, they made an unexpected decision. Make sure you pay attention and consider all the information, not just the ones with the dollar signs in front of them. And this goes of course for any binding contract.

Bobbi Rebell:
Do you have a work wife? A work bestie? Have you ever turned down something that you thought you wanted and really fought for? I wanna talk about, I wanna hear about your experiences. Follow me and DM me on all the socials, Instagram, bobbirebell1, Twitter, bobbirebell, or drop us an email at hello@financialgrownup.com, and tell me what you thought about this episode. And tell me about your experiences. And please, if you're not already subscribed, do so, we have some incredible guests lined up for spring, and I can't wait to share them with all of you.

Bobbi Rebell:
Definitely pick up Work Wife, it will not disappoint, and check out Of a Kind. So much cool stuff there. Big thanks to Erica and Claire for helping us all get one step closer to being Financial Grownups.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownup with Bobbi Rebell is edited and produced by Steve Stewart and is a BRK Media production.

As the Financial Grownup Podcast approaches 200 episodes, Bobbi explains why she is shutting down the podcast to focus on her other ventures including the Money in the Morning Podcast, her follow up book to “How to be a Financial Grownup” and what’s next for her growing media company. 

Episode Links

• The Washington Post article mentioned - How parents of adults can (gently) close the doors to the Bank of Mom and Dad

• Money in the Morning podcast

The market for Initial Public Offerings is red hot. But before jumping in, financial grownups need to understand how they work, and why they can be a lot more complicated than many people know. 

Episode Links:

• Stephan Paternot's Financial Grownup episode

• Allison Task's Financial Grownup episode

• Tanya Van Court's Financial Grownup episode

• ETF’s that invest in IPO’s

• Renaissance Capital IPO ETF

• Investopedia does a great job explaining IPO’s here

• Read more about the Pinterest IPO

• Read more about the Instinet IPO Bobbi invested in here
  

A side hustle can be a great source of extra income for things like paying down debt. But sometimes that whole paying taxes thing can slip through the cracks when the income isn’t coming from a big company with automatic withholding. Before he was the money savvy personal finance expert of today Student Loan Solution author David Carlson learned an expensive lesson about financial planning.

In David's money story you will learn:

• Why it's important to pay attention to the taxes taken out of each paycheck

• How overlooking the taxes being withdrawn from his wife's paychecks ended up costing them $8,000 in taxes

• Why it's important to put money aside for taxes from your side hustle's

In David’s money lesson you will learn:

• Why it's important to set aside some time for your finances and taxes

• Why people in their 20's generally do better to take more taxes with each paycheck

In David's everyday money tip you will learn:

• Why you should consider refinancing your student loans more than just once

• When refinancing, having a good credit score is so important so try to keep improving your credit score

In My Take you will learn:

• If you find yourself, like David and his wife, owing money on taxes, there are solutions! The most important thing is to still file your tax return

• Why it's so important to stay on top of the news when it comes to student loans

Episode Links:

David's website for his new book - www.StudentLoanSolutionBook.com

David's new book Student Loan Solution

David's other book Hustle Away Debt

Kristin Wong's episode

Check out David's website -

www.YoungAdultMoney.com

Follow David!

• Instagram - @David_Carlson

• Facebook - @YoungAdultMoney

• Twitter - @YoungAdultMoney

• Pinterest - @YoungAdultMoney

• LinkedIn - @DavidCarlson1

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Transcription

David Carlson:
And really was the perfect storm where no quarterly estimated tax on the side hustle income, not taken enough out of our regular paychecks and we owed $8,000.

Bobbi Rebell:
You're listening to Financial Grownup with me, certified financial planner, Bobbi Rebell author of How to Be a Financial Grownup. And you know what? Being a grown-up is really hard, especially when it comes to money, but it's okay. We're going to get there together. I'm going to bring you one money story from a financial grownup, one lesson and then my take on how you can make it your own. We got this.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hello financial grownups. That was the voice of David Carlson personal finance expert and now two time author. His first book was Hustle Away Debt. He now has come out with Student Loan Solution. The story he shares with us today though was about a very amateur move that he and his wife made in their younger days, but if we're being honest guys, it's the kind of mistake a lot of us have made, Just saying.

Bobbi Rebell:
Welcome everyone, including our newest listeners. Thank you for checking out the show. I want to know how you heard about us. Please DM me on the socials and say hello on Instagram @BobbiRebell1 and Twitter @BobbiRebell or you can email us at hello@financialgrownup.com.

Bobbi Rebell:
Back to our friend David Carlson. His new book, as I mentioned is called Student Loan Solution: 5 Steps to Take Control of your Student Loans and Financial Life. And he knows a lot about student debt because his efforts to pay that down led to not paying something else. Here is David Carlson.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey David Carlson, you're at Financial Grownup. Welcome to the podcast.

David Carlson:
Hey Bobbi, thanks for having me.

Bobbi Rebell:
Congratulations on your new book Student Loan Solution. You're a familiar name to many people who follow the personal finance space, who want to learn more about managing their own money and having more money, which is always a good thing because you're a well-known author and speaker. This is not your first book. You also wrote Hustle Away Debt and you were also the founder of Young Adult Money. So it's tax season. We talk a lot about multiple income streams and side hustles. You and your wife are so good at this. Lots of income streams, lots of side hustles. But there is one big caveat when it comes to taxes that you guys discovered, not in the best situation. Tell us your money story, David.

David Carlson:
Yeah, so this kind of dates back a few years ago, my wife and I, our first full year of marriage we were both pretty recent college graduates the past year or two. Just to kind of give some context, my wife was studying for the GRE and working a few part time jobs, so she nannied. She worked a couple of other places as well, so she was working a lot. But the thing that we didn't do was look at how much was being taken out of her paycheck for taxes.

Bobbi Rebell:
How much was being taken out, anything?

David Carlson:
Well with her nannying job, which was the primary income. Yeah, nothing. Which honestly, if you would've just asked, we would've kind of been on top of things, we would have known that and been able to plan around that, but we didn't. So we kind of assumed, oh, maybe they're taking a little bit out of your paycheck to account for that.

David Carlson:
And honestly, like I said, this was first year of marriage, newer college grads, this excuse that everybody uses. But I would say that we were super busy with a lot going on in our lives and we kind of dropped the ball on checking the pay stubs, checking what was being taken out.

Bobbi Rebell:
And you also had side hustles yourself.

David Carlson:
Yeah, that's kind of what made this even worse was that was my first year that I had made significant side hustle. And by significant, I mean more than $100, $200. So a few thousand inside hustle income. Back then it was primarily freelance writing, but also I was working on spreadsheets for some small businesses, which people always kind of find unique. But in my full-time job as an accountant at the time I was working spreadsheets all day. So it was kind of a natural fit.

Bobbi Rebell:
So Ironic, you're working as an accountant, but you're not paying taxes on the side hustle income. So what happened? How did this get discovered and tell me about that conversation and what was the damage?

David Carlson:
Yeah, so we at the end of the year, got everything together, put everything in the TurboTax and saw, hey you owe $8,000 in taxes. And we were like, ah, that can't be right because we were used to throughout college and whatnot, getting some sort of refund and really kind of banking on that. For sure not expecting to pay anything in. So $8,000 and I mean really when you look back at all makes sense. I was claiming one on my W4 for allowances. Really if I would have claimed zero it could have helped cover off on some of the taxes that weren't being withheld from my wife's paychecks. And really it was kind of the perfect storm where no quarterly estimated tax on the side hustle income, not taken enough out of our regular paychecks. And Yeah, we owed $8,000.

Bobbi Rebell:
How did you feel? What was the conversation like?

David Carlson:
There may have been tear shed, but thankfully we had set aside some money to purchase a new vehicle. But again that money was for the vehicle purchase so that got wiped out and cover the taxes, which was unfortunate because you kind of feel like you made all this progress on saving. Again fresh out of college. So finally making some decent income but got wiped out.

Bobbi Rebell:
So what is the lesson from that story for our listeners?

David Carlson:
The biggest lesson, just kind of broader terms was even if you're busy, set aside 30 minutes, an hour, really anytime you can put towards your finances and taxes. Something that people, I think intentionally and that that time myself don't think about until it comes tax time. But if you do a little bit of planning halfway through the year, look at your pay stubs, how much has been taken out, you need to have more withheld, what adjustments you need to make. For me personally, now I have not only zero allowances claim, but I also have additional money withheld each paycheck just to count for side hustle income. My wife does the same thing, so you can set yourself up to not owe anything if you don't want to and you just have to know your personality. Are you somebody who kind of banks on that refund and looks forward to it and it's really part of your financial plan or are you somebody who wants to pay as little as possible, than maybe ongoing $1,000 isn't a big deal.

Bobbi Rebell:
I think that's a really interesting point because people approached taxes and the concept of refunds very differently this year in 2019. We're grappling with a new tax system for the 2018 tax law change and a lot of people are not getting refunds, but in some cases it's not that they're paying more taxes. Some people are of course, but some people, it's just that their withholding was not adjusted properly, was over adjusted, let's say, and they were being given too much money in their paycheck for take home pay, not withholding enough. So it appears and feels like they're paying more in taxes. So a lot of this is psychological, right?

David Carlson:
Yeah. what I've seen is people in their 20s for the most part, they tend to do better if they do get that refund versus having to pay in just because finances are so tight and there's always something else that money can go towards. So even though you're giving the government kind of a interest free loan you could say, especially when you're starting out, it might make sense to kind of overshoot it and get that refund versus trying to get nothing back.

Bobbi Rebell:
Let's move on to your money tip because this is really in your area of specialty having to do with student loans and the whole idea of how to manage them after you graduate. How is the best way not only to be paying them off but to finance the loan that you do have because people talk a lot about refinancing. It's not a one shot deal necessarily, right?

David Carlson:
Yeah, and I think a lot of people when they do refinance student loans in particular, you go through the process, you find the company that are going to refinance with. You find a rate that looks good to you, so you refinance once and you kind of set it and forget it. But one opportunity that people have, and I think this is important because private student loans, which you either have or you got through refinancing, don't have as many advantages as federal student loans. So I think this is a great thing for people who do have those private loans to think about. You don't have to just refinance once. You can look six, 12 months down the road after refinancing and see is there any other company out there that's going to offer me a better rate? And as long as there is no origination fees with that new loan, there's no reason not to take advantage of it. And right now there's so many companies that are looking to refinance student loans and build up their balance sheet of student loans. If you look enough, you most likely will find a better rate, especially if your credit score has improved over time, your credit history is solid, that's how you're going to be able to unlock some of those better opportunities.

Bobbi Rebell:
You mentioned the origination fee. Can you explain what that is and is that something that you can negotiate if there is one, can you say to them, well, I'm only going to switch to you if you can give me some help with that.

David Carlson:
Yeah, that's not common with the student loan refinancing because again, I think a lot of banks are not desperate, but they really want to get into the student loan refinance game.

Bobbi Rebell:
What's not common is it's not common to have origination fees.

David Carlson:
Yeah. It's not common to have one because it's just a disincentive for them to go with you. And again, like if you search on Google student loan refinance, the first five or six results are all going to be ads because there's so many companies trying to get in front of you so that you'll refinance with them. So it's not common. But I did want to point out if there are fees that come with setting up a new way.

Bobbi Rebell:
Avoid them.

David Carlson:
Yeah. Yup.

Bobbi Rebell:
Right. And is there any other strategy that you could use to make yourself more desirable? Obviously your credit score could get better as you move away from school and into your career. Other things that can make you a better candidate for the best refinancing.

David Carlson:
Yeah, it's they'll take a look at your income. So income and credit score are the most important. And credit score really being the most important because if you have a high credit score, it means that you are a reliable person. More likely than not, you're going to continue to make your payments on time. So I'd say I'd really stress the credit score aspect of that. Make sure that you're doing what you can to improve that score, making your payments on time. Yeah, and I guess one way to get even a lower rate is to have a cosigner, but typically I think it's best to kind of keep your student loans separate when possible. And obviously this isn't just a tip for student loans. You can also use personal loans as an example where if you have one that's going to take you five to 10 years to pay off for whatever reason, it might make sense to keep looking for that better rate every six to 12 months.

Bobbi Rebell:
Just some of the great advice in your new book, Student Loan Solution: 5 Steps to Take Control of your Student Loans. By the way, there's a forward in there, everyone from Financial Grownup guest Kristin Wong, she's also the author of Get Money. We will link to her episode and you also have endorsements from some notable people including our friend Shannah Compton Game from Millennial Money Podcast. You also have Jason Vitek who wrote You Only Live Once and [inaudible 00:12:09] who is the founder of [inaudible 00:12:10]. And you know what? Yours truly, I also endorsed the book. I think it's a really wonderful tool for everybody. Tell us more about where people can find more about you and the book.

David Carlson:
Yeah, so you can go on Amazon to check out the books. So just search student loan solution. We also have a book website but the URLs is little bit long studentloansolutionbook.com because I was too cheap to buy StudentLoanSolution.com.

Bobbi Rebell:
We can remember that David. We'll find you. We'll link to it in our show notes don't worry.

David Carlson:
And then my website as Bobbi mentioned earlier, youngadultmoney.com personal finance blog for those in their 20s and 30s. And then I'm on Twitter @DavidCarlson1 and then Instagram David_Carlson.

Bobbi Rebell:
Congratulations again David. Thank you so much.

David Carlson:
Thank you for having me.

Bobbi Rebell:
Let's get to it my friends, Financial Grownup tip number one. If you find yourself like David and his wife owing money on taxes and that's happening to a lot of us, if alike them, you do not have money set aside. There are solutions. The most important thing is to still file your tax return. If you ignore this problem, trust me it is not going away. But what you need to remember is believe it or not, the IRS, the government, as with any lender, anyone you owe money to is to some degree your partner, they want you to pay. And they will work with you depending on the solution that you work out with them you may owe penalties and you may owe interest but you're not going to go to jail if you're cooperating with them and working out a solution, it's going to be okay.

Bobbi Rebell:
You can contact the IRS to work things out. The phone number is 1-800-829-1040. We will also leave a link in the show notes to the irs.gov website and to the pages that you need to get to in order to figure out what kind of payment plan or other solution you can work out with the IRS if you owe money. It's all explained there. It's very well laid out. Don't forget to adjust your withholding for this year, 2019 so you don't face a similar situation next year.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial grownup tip number two, stay on top of the news when it comes to student loans. Unfortunately this has become a political issue and some programs that were put into effect by previous administrations could be changed under the Trump presidency, so stay informed. I will leave some links to recent articles about proposed changes already in motion in some cases in the show notes and you can find the show notes always at bobbyrebell.com/financialgrownuppodcast.

Bobbi Rebell:
If you don't see the episode that you were looking for just by scrolling down, use the search bar on the upper right corner to search by the guest's name or any other keyword. For example, you could search in this case for student loan or taxes. I also want to mention that David has a number of companion materials to his book that you can access on his website at studentloansolutionbook.com and he also has some very cool freebies. And speaking of freebies, this podcast is free. The only payment that I ask of you guys is that you help us grow the show and that means first of all just making sure that you're subscribed so that the show auto downloads in your feed and you don't miss any episodes.

Bobbi Rebell:
If you have a free moment, reviews are so appreciated. They really mean a lot. And when people go to decide whether they want to subscribe to the show, they see good reviews and hopefully it motivates them to subscribe. And of course, the most powerful thing and the most appreciated thing is when you share it with friends who you think would also enjoy the podcast and maybe in some cases even show them what a podcast is, what the app is on their phone, and how to subscribe and download the episodes.

Bobbi Rebell:
Big thanks to David Carlson, author of the new book Student Loan Solution for helping us all get one step closer to being Financial Grownups. Financial Grownup with Bobby rebel is edited and produced by Steve Stewart and is a BRK Media production.

Million Dollar Listing star Ryan Serhant, whose new book “Sell It Like Serhant” is already a best seller, and his younger brother Jack had what seemed like a brilliant idea for firewood a business at age 10. While the business went down in flames, the lessons formed a foundation for Serhant’s extreme success in the real estate and entertainment business. 

In Ryan's money story you will learn:

-Why he says he was not a natural salesperson

-How 10-year old Ryan and his 7-year old brother started a firewood business to make money on their family farm

-The challenges the boys faced including difficult customers, and uncooperative vendors

-Why they were literally left on the side of the road by a worker!

In Ryan's money lesson you will learn:

-How to deal with challenging customers

-Why you have to anticipate an be prepared with realistic expectations when you start a business

In Ryan's everyday money tip you will learn:

-How to use the faces app to motivate you to work harder for your future!

-The specific way that photo helps Ryan avoid overspending

-The impact that the failure of Lehman Brothers had on Ryan's outlook

Ryan and Bobbi also talk about:

-Why Ryan belonged to three gyms

-Ryan's daily routine and how can apply parts of it to your life

-Tips on how entrepreneurs can structure their days

-Why Ryan studies the top business leaders

-Ryan's Finder, Keeper, and Do-er system

-How many times you need to follow up if you want to work for Ryan!

In My Take you will learn:

-How to use the tips from Ryan's book Sell it Like Servant for both offense and Defense when it comes to sales techniques

-How to take Ryan's strategy of studying high achievers to the micro level and apply it to your own life meeting and learning from others

Find out more about Ryan at

https://ryanserhant.com

Follow Ryan!!

Instagram @ryanserhant

Twitter @ryanserhant

Get Ryan’s Book "Sell it Like Serhant"

sellitlikeserhant.com

Check out Ryan’s Vlog! youtube.com/ryanserhant

Learn more about Ryan's hit Bravo shows!

Million Dollar Listing New York

Sell It Like Serhant

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

TRANSCRIPTION

Ryan Serhant:
We got into this fight with this one guy that wanted us to stack his would be in a strange way in his house around all the different fireplaces, because I also didn't prepare for how people wanted the wood actually delivered. And my delivery guy got really pissed off, got in his pickup truck and he drove off and left me and my little seven-year-old brother on the side of the street.

Bobbi Rebell:
You're listening to Financial Grownup with me, certified financial planner, Bobbi Rebell. Author of How to Be a Financial Grownup. But you know what? Being a grown up is really hard, especially when it comes to money. But it's okay, we're going to get there together. I'm going to bring you one money story from a financial grownup, one lesson, and then my take on how you can make it your own. We got this.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey Financial Grownup friends, that was million-dollar listing star and newly minted author, Ryan Serhant, getting real about his first sale experience. It did not go well. Thanks everyone for joining me. This episode is a big deal, and not just because of Ryan Serhant. He is a big deal, though. It's even bigger because it is Episode 100 of the Financial Grownup podcast. We are also celebrating being a finalist for best new personal finance podcast at the Plutus Awards. And, the paperback of my book, How to be a Financial Grownup, is coming up October 2nd. None of this would be possible without my amazing editor and secret weapon, Steve Stewart. So, thank you, Steve. And thanks to all of you for joining us on this journey.

Bobbi Rebell:
Now, to the fantastic Ryan Serhant. When you read his book, Sell It Like Serhant, and if the title sounds familiar, yes, he has another reality TV show on Bravo called Sell It Like Serhant, you're going to learn more about this incredible guy. But of note, he says he was not a natural salesman. That came later after learning from experience. So, we talked about how he learned about sales and being successful in business. Here is Ryan Serhant.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey Ryan Serhant, you're a financial grownup, welcome to the podcast.

Ryan Serhant:
Thank you for having me.

Bobbi Rebell:
And happy pub day, we are taping this on the day that you're amazing book, Sell It Like Serhant: How to Sell More, Earn More, and Become the Ultimate Sales Machine, is coming out. It's already a bestseller and comes on the heels of so much other success. Like million-dollar listing New York, and my new obsession, your vlog. So, congrats on all.

Ryan Serhant:
Oh, thank you. Thank you. I appreciate it.

Bobbi Rebell:
I want to talk to you about your money story that you brought. It has to do with the very first experience you had in sales, which makes perfect sense coming from the ultimate sales guy. Tell us about the firewood and your brother.

Ryan Serhant:
So, I wasn't a natural salesperson. And I think it's very hard for people to be born as natural sales people. And what that even means, I could write a whole nother book about it. But I was a very shy and little kid. All I knew was that in order to be able to have money to spend, I had to make money. And if my parents weren't going to give it to me and if I was in school and was too young to get a job, what could I do?

Ryan Serhant:
We lived on a farm outside Boston, and my little brother was seven. We were doing a lot of ... my parents were kind of like cutting down trees and making way for pastures and things like that. And I just saw all these trees laying all over the place. And asked my dad one day, "What are you doing with all of those streets?" He was like, "Wow, they get cut off, they get sold off. They get turned into malts. It just kind of gets recycled." And I was like, "Well, we have fireplaces in our house and we get firewood, don't you buy that from somewhere? What if we take the trees and we cut it up and I sell the firewood?" I had no idea how he's going to do it, I was not big enough to hold an axe. But my dad said. "Okay."

Ryan Serhant:
He said, "What's your company going to be called if you're going to be a firewood selling company?" And we took out a little ad in our local newspaper. I think it was called Ryan Jack, because my little brother's name is jack, Firewood Company. I think that's literally what it was.

Bobbi Rebell:
Who paid for the ad, Ryan?

Ryan Serhant:
We did out of our minimal allowance.

Bobbi Rebell:
Okay. So, this was your startup capital costs?

Ryan Serhant:
Yeah, that was our startup capital cost. Because they were doing all this tree clearing anyway, there was a wood splitter that was already there. And my little brother and I started splitting wood, and we bulk it up into chords, and we put it in the back of a pickup truck. And then we would get the guy that kind of was helping cut down the trees to be our delivery guy to then go supply people with their firewood. And that was our first little business. And it came crashing down.

Bobbi Rebell:
Yeah, that's what I was going to say. There were some challenges, things you didn't think about.

Ryan Serhant:
Well, I didn't think about customer service and how to deal with people who are unhappy with their firewood. All I knew was I live at this house down the street, there's a bunch of cut down trees, we're going to cut it up and sell it. What do you mean that there's different types of firewood, different types of trees, different types of drying, termites, all these things I didn't even think about?

Ryan Serhant:
So, we had some tough customers in the beginning, and I also didn't think about how I was going to get the word anywhere. So, I thought that the guy that was cutting down trees was going to help and just help us drop it off, we're little kids. But he wanted to cut, and then we got into this fight with this one guy that wanted us to stack his wood really really in a strange way in his house around all the different fireplaces, because I also didn't prepare for how people wanted to what actually delivered. And my delivery guy got really pissed off, got his pickup truck, and he drove off and left me my little seven-year-old brother on the side of the street which is random guy.

Bobbi Rebell:
You're kids. Oh, my gosh.

Ryan Serhant:
Yap. That was the end of our firewood business.

Bobbi Rebell:
Wait, in the end, was there a profit or loss when all settled in?

Ryan Serhant:
Definitely a loss. I don't know how much we lost, because I didn't really understand what my time was worth at 10 years old.

Bobbi Rebell:
Exactly.

Ryan Serhant:
And our capital cost was that one ad. We might have run two ads. I can't remember what they cost. Maybe it was 20 bucks and ad. It wasn't a huge loss, but it definitely was a ding to the self-esteem that maybe I don't want to run my own firewood selling business.

Bobbi Rebell:
Glad you moved on to real estate. What's the takeaway for our listeners?

Ryan Serhant:
The takeaway from that is anticipate and be prepared with realistic expectations. Just having wood to chop down and sell it is a very, very small part of actually creating a firewood selling business. So, you need to be prepared for all the objections and all the issues you're going to run into.

Bobbi Rebell:
Which are things that apply to all sales, which we'll get to in just a minute. I just want to get to your everyday money tip.

Ryan Serhant:
Yeah, there's something that I have in the office. That is a photo of myself as an 80-year-old man. There's this app you can get on your phone called the Faces App, someone just showed it to me. You take your photo of yourself and it realistically ages you, which is pretty crazy. But that photo is future Ryan. And every day, I think about that guy. Because I mean, it feels like just yesterday that I was that 10-year-old kid selling firewood or trying to sell it anyway. Before I know it, I'm going to be that guy. And everything I do today is for him. It's not for Ryan this coming weekend, it's not for Ryan next year. All of that is going to happen regardless. But I don't want 80-year-old Ryan pissed off at 34-year-old Ryan because he made poor money decisions or poor savings decisions, or he's just spent too much. That is my money tip.

Bobbi Rebell:
Which is a great one. So, is there a specific ... Can you remember maybe one example of you kind of not being that motivated and then looking at that photo and being like, "Yeah, I got to do this."

Ryan Serhant:
Every time I think about spending money on things that don't need, I look at that photo. It's just like I ... and I don't want to sound cheap. But I don't need that many pairs of shoes. I run around the suit all day long. I don't need that many suits. Little things where I could have spent money and just because I have it or just because whatever, it's just credit, I think about that like, "You know what? I should save it, because compound interest is a powerful thing." And it's better off just being saved because you never know what could happen.

Ryan Serhant:
And at the end of the day, I got into sales business the day Lehman Brothers filed for bankruptcy, and I will never forget the pain that a lot of people went through at the end of 2008. And that's going to come back again, I don't know when. But it's probably going to come back multiple times by the time that I'm that old man in the photo that I have by my computer screen.

Bobbi Rebell:
Let's talk about your book, because I'm learning so much. Not so much as someone that sells, but as someone that is sold to. So, it's quite eye opening, Ryan, the things that happen.

Ryan Serhant:
Thank you.

Bobbi Rebell:
It's kind of written as an offense, but it can also be defense. So, I want to go through some of my favorite things in your favorite things in the book. We talked before we started taping about your day. Tell us how a successful person at age, by the way, you're all of 34, you're always one of the journalist top sales people, you've been winning all kinds of accolades as a salesperson, and you're only 34. What do you? What's your day look like?

Ryan Serhant:
I start my day at 4:30, Monday through Friday. And it's just because I want to squeeze out as much of the day as I possibly can. I don't want-

Bobbi Rebell:
Are you sleeping at 8:00 or ... How much sleep do you get?

Ryan Serhant:
I try to go to bed by 11:00.

Bobbi Rebell:
So, you don't sleep a lot of hours.

Ryan Serhant:
Not Monday through Friday. I'll sleep in on Saturdays to like eight or so. A lot of people just wake up and go to a job or go to work, and they don't really sit down and try to game plan for their career. I only have a few things during the day that I do that I consider part of my job. Everything else I do is for growth and for my career as a whole to make that 80-year-old guy happy one day. And a lot of that goes down to how you structure your actual day.

Ryan Serhant:
And for any sales people who are listening, any entrepreneurs, anybody who really answers to themselves, I had to figure out, what do I do at 9:00 a.m.? Do I cold call? Do I go out on the streets? No one's telling me what to do. And so, I looked at the top companies in the world, even I was just one person and I said, "Okay, all just top companies have CEO, CFO, COOs, I need to have the same thing, even though I'm just one person. So, that means I got to do it all on my own, and not all the same time, I need to separate it. You know what? The CEO, I'm going to call the finder, because I'm not really my own CEO. But I can be a finder of new business, a finder of new leads, a finder of work that the rest of my company can do for the rest of the day. I'm going to do that from 8:00 to 10:00 a.m. 12:00 to 1:00 p.m., I'll be the keeper, so that's the CFO hours. That's when I would think about, "Okay, well, I've $10 to spend today. How many stamps can I buy with that $10?"

Ryan Serhant:
And I would think about kind of the financial health of my "company", which when I first started was nonexistent. And now it's really thinking about all the advertising budgets that we have, and the people and the moving and the salaries. And then the rest of the day, I'd spend being the doer. So, finder, keeper, doer is what I call it, FKD. So, finder, keeper, doer, and the rest of the day I'd spend as the doer, which is the COO. Sets operations, it's doing the work, it's doing-

Bobbi Rebell:
Which just a few can delegate more now.

Ryan Serhant:
Yeah, which now, the majority of my day is as the finder. When I started, the majority of my day was as the doer. I'd think for half an hour or an hour, because I didn't have that much to think about as to how I wanted to grow my business, I didn't have any money. So, that wouldn't take me that long to think about. And then the rest of the day, I put everything into action. Now, I have a team that can handle a lot of the doer work, and a team of accountants and bookkeepers that can handle a lot of the financials. And I spend 75% of my day as the finder, as that CEO trying to build the business.

Bobbi Rebell:
One thing I loved regarding Finder, and getting new business in the book was your strategy initially, and I don't know if you still do this. I can't imagine you have time to do this. You saw that it was working to meet people at the gym, potential clients. So, you expanded on that.

Ryan Serhant:
Yes. I think it's important to do what works for you, and then just to do it over and over again in as many different places as you can.

Ryan Serhant:
I knew when I first moved to New York City, I'm not from New York. It's not going to help me or be a good use of my time to go to school functions that other brokers are going to just because they went to school on the Upper East Side, or to go to the church, or go to the synagogue, just to say that I'm religious, but I'm not, just to meet people, which is what most sales people do. So, for me, I really had work, I would do to the gym. And the gym was a good place for me to meet people who had a similar interest, which was kind of general fitness. And if I go to a nice gym, maybe they also could afford a nice apartment, so they can afford a nice gym. And that worked. I saw it worked. And I said, "Okay, you know what? This is now my thing. So, I'm going to go to another gym as well. And then I'm going to go to another gym. And I'm going to go to as many jobs as I can, because that's what works for me. And that's going to be where I build my network." And then for the first couple years, that's really what I did.

Bobbi Rebell:
What is the thing that you make people do if they really want to work for you? It's not just about one follow up.

Ryan Serhant:
Oh, I make them follow up for a considerable period of time. Because the power of follow up is my whole business. Deals live and die by how persistent I am to get the deal done. And I tell everybody, I don't work for anyone. I work for the deal all the time as a salesperson. And my job is to get that deal done to everybody's benefit. And so, if people want to work for me, I interview them, for sure. I have them interview a couple people on the team. But then I just, I call them. I let them sit and I wait to see how often they're going to follow up with me. Most people will follow up once, twice, maybe three times. And after that, they let it go.

Ryan Serhant:
You know how many deals I would have lost if I let it go after three follow ups? Unbelievable. So, I can't have that kind of person on my team. They got to want to be on my team more than I want them to be there, because that's the person who's going to be hungry enough to get difficult deals done for me.

Bobbi Rebell:
So much amazing information in your book and on your vlog, by the way. We didn't really talk about that. That's million-dollar listing, I didn't really realize this until you talked about it in your book, it's only on for three months of the year. So, people need to be watching your vlog.

Ryan Serhant:
Yeah, I think so. I put it out there as a way to put out a lot of the rest of my life and a lot of things that just aren't on Bravo. Bravo is real estate focused and it follows the individual deals. It's not with me in the car 24 hours a day, kind of in my thoughts and in my mindset, and that's what the blog is for.

Bobbi Rebell:
Awesome. All right. Tell people where they can find you, follow you, find out more, get the book, all that good stuff.

Ryan Serhant:
The book just came out today, it's called Sell it Like Serhant, it's everywhere books are sold. Amazon, Barnes and Noble, you can find all the links at sellitlikeserhant.com. You can find me across all social media platforms at Ryan Serhant, and the vlog is @youtube.com/ryanserhant.

Bobbi Rebell:
Thank you, Ryan. This was great.

Ryan Serhant:
Thank you.

Bobbi Rebell:
Let's unpack some of the things that Ryan said. Financial Grownup tip number one. I read Ryan's book twice. The reason I went back was to take notes. Now, I'm not in sales, at least not in a direct way. But I think it is important for all of us to understand how sales work, and the specific techniques that are being used so you can spot them. I joke about offense and defense, but that is important too. Because if we're being honest, who hasn't bonded with a salesperson, and then because of that felt they should, and sometimes did buy something they maybe wouldn't have bought otherwise? Always know that a good salesperson like Ryan will be in it for the long haul. And you can just push back. And even if you aren't a customer, now, you may be in the future. Also, the next best thing you can do is refer them to friends and family as potential customers. It's okay to do what's right for you, even if you feel an allegiance to the salesperson. We're all human.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownup tip number two. Ryan talks about how he studied the most successful companies and what top executives do. Take this to a micro level and find someone that you admire and ask them if they will talk to you. It can be coffee, a meal, or going for a walk. And if you can, maybe even ask if you can shadow them for a day at work. I did this early in my career. Just observe and learn. And if they're open to it, ask a lot of questions. Most people are flattered.

Bobbi Rebell:
On that note, I am off to Orlando to FinCon and celebrating this 100-podcast milestone with some friends. I hope you guys will DM me and let me know what you want to see in the next 100 episodes. On Twitter, I am @bobbirebell, Instagram @bobbirebell1. I have some big changes coming that I will reveal soon, so please subscribe and make sure you go into settings and hit auto download so you don't miss any episodes. Until then, feeling really grateful to Ryan Serhant for helping us all get one step closer to being Financial Grownups.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownup with Bobbi Rebell is edited and produced by Steve Stewart, and is a BRK Media production.

One of the best ways to have more money is simply to get paid more. Except is isn’t always simple. NBC Financial Editor and Her Money founder Jean Chatzky shares 4 strategies to earn more money. Jean also shares a sneak peak at her new book “Women with Money”.

Here are 4 strategies to earn more money

• Get clear on your number

• Rinse and repeat - the more you ask the easier it gets

• Add tax

• There is more than money on the table

Episode Links:

• Jean's website www.HerMoney.com

• Jean's podcast Her Money

• Jean's book Women with Money

• The website for Jean’s book www.WomenWithMoneyBook.com

• Jean's classic episode

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Reality TV can be a job- but it often doesn’t pay like one. To film The Bachelorette and later Bachelor in Paradise Derek Peth had to take a break from his paying job in commercial banking. That’s where his emergency fund savings became the star of the show. 

Derek's money story:

Bobbi Rebell:
I'm so glad that you're here and so many of your fans are going to be tuning are going to be blown away by what they learn about you, because you're so well known as one of the ... first of all you were on The Bachelor on the JoJo season.

Derek Peth:
Right.

Bobbi Rebell:
You did not apparently live happily ever after with her. But you went on to more success on Bachelor in Paradise season four. And you even now continue a side hustle, which we'll talk about, host a podcast about Bachelor in Paradise and The Bachelor. But we're here because, and this got by the way this announcement of what you're doing now got over 16 thousand likes on Instagram. We're here to talk about what you do for a living right now, which is you are in the financial services sector. You are a Senior Vice President at Laurel Road. So congratulations on this career path as well.

Derek Peth:
Thank you. This is the original career path. Speaking of side hustle, I think that's kind of what The Bachelor became for me.

Bobbi Rebell:
Exactly.

Derek Peth:
Hey, more opportunities.

Bobbi Rebell:
Absolutely. And you're stilling doing that. We're going to circle back to that, but I want to talk about your money story because what you're going to share with us is something that is, on the one hand unique to you and the people that are on reality TV shows, but also very relatable to almost anyone that has ever dreamed of taking a break from their quote, real career, their everyday job. And asking our boss for a sabbatical so that they can do something, maybe a dream, maybe an opportunity for an interesting experience. Maybe financial opportunity down the road. But that's what happened to you. You were working, all of how many years ago? Four years ago maybe?

Derek Peth:
Yeah I think it was about four-ish years ago. I was working in commercial banking as a sales role down in Florida at the time. And actually it's a funny story how it all originally happened because I wasn't ready for it. I didn't signup or anything, I was very focused on my career, and I thought it was a prank call from a radio station at first. I made them email me, and I researched them.

Bobbi Rebell:
Wait. How did they find you? I just assumed people apply to be on these shows. You just get this call.

Derek Peth:
I know. My sister signed me up.

Bobbi Rebell:
Oh my gosh.

Derek Peth:
I didn't figure it out until three weeks later when finally I ... because I had been kind of quiet about it and then finally I was like, "Hey did you happen to sign me up for The Bachelor ever?" And boom. There we go.

Bobbi Rebell:
She didn't tell you? Oh my gosh.

Derek Peth:
No. Her friends watch the show and it was like they all got around the computer and sent my photos and information in. But when I started thinking about this, it was like this is one of those opportunities that are once in a lifetime that can change the course of your life completely. And luckily, my mom has put self-help books in front of me my whole life, and I've been very, always interested in making sure that things were setup so that ... I ran some marketing businesses on the side when I was younger. I had a nice foundation of rental income incoming constantly that put me in a situation where I was like, "You know what? I don't necessarily need to have this job." While I enjoy what I'm doing, and I have a great relationship with my boss at the time. He really tried and he was like, "Listen, you're a sales role."

Bobbi Rebell:
Well what happened? Can you go in and say, "Hey I'm going to be on a reality TV show can I have a sabbatical of I don't know how long?" How does it work?

Derek Peth:
Exactly. I called him up. I said, "Hey I really need to have a side conversation that needs to be pretty quiet because there's some legal matters." And he was freaked out so he called me right away. But the legal matter was that I couldn't really discuss what the situation was with a bunch of people. And I just said, "I don't know. It could be one week that I'm gone, it could be eight weeks, 10 weeks." That's how long they tape for, and you have no idea going in. He went back and he reached out to HR and they tried to figure something out, but in the end, the response was basically, "This is a little too much of an ask right now, Derek. The only option is, if you want to do this you have to leave and quit, or you can keep working here. And call us back afterwards." The truth is, there's no chance on us just putting and eight week paused on your role.

Derek Peth:
Like you said, I saw it as a sabbatical of sorts, because there was that open end coming back, which I built from working by butt off in my job. And I built that foundation that I could really use to support my living without a normal income by working my butt off on the side. And again, I think there's a lesson there that really gives you the opportunity to do some unique and different things sometimes in life that we all dream and talk about, but when you're forcing yourself into the bare minimums, that's where I think, like I said, luckily I've had some of that literature in front of me my whole life and it was just pounded in my head, "Make sure you have enough income to live for a full year with what you're doing."

Bobbi Rebell:
You had a full year of income saved?

Derek Peth:
I did.

Bobbi Rebell:
How do people support themselves on these shows? Do you get paid to be on, do you get paid more if you last longer on the show? How does it work?

Derek Peth:
Some of those work that way. The actual Bachelor, Bachelorette, the first one there's no income from it, but the second show that I did that you talked about, it works that way where it's a per day payment situation. And so, it depends on what show you're talking about. Obviously, as we both know, the Instagram ad game has become I think the goal for a lot of people after that. And that's where the supporting themselves, and being a public figure offers some cool opportunities to do some travel where, if you're going and doing speaking somewhere or just doing an event anywhere, a lot of times there's free travel or the event itself, I should say, takes care of the travel and the accommodations. It is a unique situation. It's a little bit different than having to jump on Spirit because you're flying all over the place.

Bobbi Rebell:
But people going on these shows are not necessarily paid. There are costs involved, and you often lose your income. I don't know that people really understand that.

Derek Peth:
Yes. And that's why a lot of the people end up on the show, I think, are entrepreneurs. When you really think about it, there's business people and some small business owners a lot of the time, and it's because they have the flexibility to do that, they don't have this fear of having to jump of a cliff with their job, because it's scary thing. Not to mention just the nature of the United States these days. I don't know the exact numbers, but the cost of college has quadrupled or more in the last few years, and when you really look at that and compare that to what you come away with, and what you need, we have to have that income in order to just survive, right? Just the environment itself has made it so hard for people to jump out and do anything unique like this without cutting away, and living at home, and dodging their student loans.

Derek’s money lesson:

I think that rule is so important for people to live by. Instead of focusing on how do I get to the next paycheck, you got to focus on a rule, a separate goal. And that maybe 5% of their income for some people, 10% of their income. That's a conversation, especially if there's relationships, there's other situations that come in, but instead of maxing out what you're making, there needs to be savings goal and then a long-term goal of course. One of my favorite sayings is, how do you eat the elephant? One bite at a time. You have your big goal, but then one little step at a time, each month, each week, you're saving that money away, and that's how you, I think, create that foundation to give you the opportunity to go and do some different things.

Bobbi Rebell:
And also because as much as these kinds of ventures can create opportunity, at the end of the day, you're not an actor.

Derek Peth:
Right.

Bobbi Rebell:
You have a normal life to some degree. It will never be quite as normal again, and you're still doing a lot of Bachelor related things, but you have an actual job.

Derek Peth:
There's a few very successful individuals. No different than professional sports. Honestly every aspect of business and any job in and of itself has high performers, and medium as well. But a lot of people in that quote, medium performance, which of course relates to how many Instagram followers you have now. But they really butt their head up against the wall and get sucked into this life with these hopes and aspirations without the understanding that it does take the work no different than your job to do some hustling, to make connections, to call people, to set things up for yourself. They do the bare minimum, and sometimes that's nice for a little while, but I mean, I think the people who have been very successful with taking this opportunity that The Bachelor presents you with and have treated it like a job. You see some of those folks who previously had jobs.

Derek Peth:
I have a great example from my season. Wells, great example. They were high performers in what they were doing already. And they pivoted everything into, all right, this is my new side gig. I can just take the same lesson I learned from working hard and taking care of business in my day-to-day life and apply it to this new opportunity.

Derek's everyday money tip:

My money tip, especially for millennials like myself is, first and foremost, within the marketplace we're in, there's an urgency to refinance your student loans. We ourselves we save over $20 thousand, on average, for people who refinance their loans, when you look at the life of their loans. I think knowing your rate in the first place is a great place to start. A lot of people, a lot of my friends even when I started working at Laurel Road they didn't even know what their rate was. And I started talking to them about the opportunities and they were just mind-blown at how much they could save each year.

I don't mean that facetiously. They were shooting, kicking themselves saying, "Hey, I'm an idiot. I haven't been looking at this. I didn't even know that. Here I am complaining about my income, and I could have saved it just by going online, doing a little bit of research." And to all those millennials out there, or anyone else who's recently gone through school and still has those student loans, go refinance them. There's no cost. It's very quick. I'm going to say, go check out Laurel Road's website because we are, I think, the best at this, but across the board, that's the number one thing we need to be doing.

Financial grownup tip number one:

Emergency funds aren't just for when bad things happen. In this case, a really amazing thing happened, a once in a lifetime opportunity. Literally life-changing experiences, and Derek had the financial resources available to cover up to a year. So when he was on The Bachelorette, not a lot of financial stress. And then even more fun on Bachelor in Paradise. And by the way, did I mention he hosts The Bachelor podcast, which is strangely addicting, even though I don't even know all the people that Derek, and Kay his co-host, are talking about. Don't be judgey. Derek has had a great ride. And I'm not saying that I know anything, or that Derek told me any upcoming projects, maybe when we kept talking after we stopped taping. But you want to stay tuned to what Derek is up to. Follow him on all the socials, and keep tabs on him at Laurel Road.

Financial grownup tip number two:

I joked with Derek about being judgey. We can all get judgey, myself included, about productivity, and joke that if we spend all day watching Netflix, or whatever, on Instagram, on our social media channels, we're not going to be building our businesses, our personal brand empires or whatever our goals are. So yes, we have to be mindful of our time. Go listen to the Laura Vanderkam episode for tips on that, by the way. But you know what, I really enjoyed Derek and his cohost on The Bachelor podcast. And the Bachelor shows are really fund. If that's your thing, enjoy it. Like all indulgences, chocolate, try to keep it under control. Maybe do a Bachelor in Paradise marathon over the holidays with your friends, get it out of your system for a little bit, then be more productive in the new year. Enjoy it. Don't feel bad. It's all good. And then of course, come back and listen to all the good advice here on Financial Grownup to get your finances in order for the new year.

Episode Links:

• Derek’s website - Laurel Road

• The Betchelor podcast

• The Bachelor

• The Bachelorette
  

Follow Derek!

• Instagram

• Linked In

• Twitter

• Facebook

Want to learn more about productivity? Click Here to listen to our episode with "Off the Clock" Author @LauraVanderkam

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

If you are a fan of Shark Tank- our guest may look familiar. We here at the Financial Grownup podcast were so excited to see Tanya Van Court and her company, GoalSetter on the show recently trying to make a deal with the sharks.

At 29 years old Tanya Van Court thought she had more than a million dollars on hand to change the world and live the life of her dreams. Until it vanished in a few hours. 

Tanya's money story:

Tanya Van Court:
I was 29 years old, it was in the first tech boom where all of the Silicon Valley companies had stock that was just rising uncontrollably. I happened to be one of the first 200 employees at a company in Silicon Valley that was doing extraordinarily well.

Bobbi Rebell:
What company?

Tanya Van Court:
The company was Covac Communications. Before any of the telephone companies or cable companies were offering high-speed data I had a great job, a meaningful job, and I had a lot of stock that went along with that job.

Tanya Van Court:
I got all this stock in Covac, and some of the stock I couldn't cash out yet, but a lot of the stock I could cash out. I could have sold that stock and went and diversified my portfolio and bought mutual funds, or invested it in many, many stocks, as opposed to having all of my eggs sitting in one proverbial basket. But I didn't, because it was literally the first stock I had ever known or owned-

Bobbi Rebell:
Wait, let's just back it up, so you were given, as part of your compensation, shares in this company. Did it go public? Where was this stock? Explain exactly what you were given, and how it was valued, and did you have opportunities to sell it?

Tanya Van Court:
Yes, I had opportunities to sell the stock, many opportunities. The company had gone public, and so I had the opportunity to sell the stock when the company went public, I had the opportunity ... not exactly when it went public, because we had a certain window. But that window had passed, and so I had many opportunities to sell the stock, but I had no idea that I should sell the stock.

Tanya Van Court:
The stock kept going up, and I thought, "Wow, this is great. The stock just doubled in the past six months. I should just hold onto it, and I guess it will double again."

Bobbi Rebell:
At its peak what was the value of this stock, and how old were you at that time?

Tanya Van Court:
I was 29, and the value of the stock at its peak was about 1.2 million dollars.

Bobbi Rebell:
At that time how did you feel?

Tanya Van Court:
You know, I was so excited, because since I came from a household of two parents who were elementary school educators, all I ever wanted to do was make a difference in the world. I knew that having that 1.2 million dollars in my late 20s was going to enable me to make different choices and different life decisions to help people and to give back instead of just working in corporate America and doing things that were kind of interesting to me, but weren't impactful to other people. I felt free, Bobbi. I felt really free and empowered.

Bobbi Rebell:
You're 29 years old, you have stock that on paper is worth 1.2 million dollars. What happened then?

Tanya Van Court:
The big Dotcom bust happened. Literally in hours stock just started to tank for company, after company, after company. I watched the stock literally go from being in the teens, each share was trading in the teens, to trading for less than a dollar. When I say less than a dollar it went from the teens to like .50 cents in the course of a few hours. Every bit of that 1.2 million was wiped away in a matter of hours.

Bobbi Rebell:
Wow!

Tanya Van Court:
Yeah.

Bobbi Rebell:
How did you feel then?

Tanya Van Court:
Then I felt stupid, I felt deflated, I felt panicked, depressed, it was almost as if you had 1.2 million dollars sitting in your living room, and you just left the front door to your house open and walked out and went to the park, right?

Tanya Van Court:
It was, like, wait a minute. I had been living this life and treating this money so casually, as if it would always be there.

Bobbi Rebell:
As you say, it was the dotcom bust. This was happening to everyone?

Tanya Van Court:
It was happening to everyone, and it's interesting, because while I suffered a tremendous loss with that stock that I could've diversified, what I still had was ... I still had a home that I owned, I had bought a condo, and I still had that. What I found with many of my colleagues who experienced that same bust, is that they had actually leveraged their stock to buy lots of other things, so they bought cars, and they bought multiple houses.

Tanya Van Court:
Because they had borrowed against that stock, once the crash happened, they then had to pay back the money that they had borrowed by going and selling off all of their assets, including the assets that they had come to the company with.

Tanya Van Court:
If they came to the company with a big million-dollar home in Silicon Valley that was passed down to them from their parent, or that they had worked really hard in a previous company to be able to buy, now all of a sudden, they not only lost all of their stock, they lost every other asset that they had, because they had to payback loans that they had made against their stock.

Tanya’s money lesson:

Oh my gosh. Diversify, diversify, diversify. Don't ever put all of your money into one basket. I don't care if that basket is a real estate basket, and you have found a hot, booming real estate market that's working really well for you, and so you're, like, "Let me just buy it."

More apartments here in X place, or more houses in X place, don't do that. Diversify your money. If you have found that your golden goose is a stock that is doing really well, don't do that. Diversify your money. You really have to weigh and measure your risk, and think about the worst case scenarios. If that particular company, if something happens to that company, if something happens to that area of town that you're investing in, and every asset you have goes under water, what happens to your entire portfolio?

Tanya's everyday money tip:

My everyday money tip is actually a money tip that kind of goes back to my time in college. I would always watch people who ... I don't happen to drink, but I would watch people who would do progressives. Where they went from one bar to another, or one restaurant to another, and progressively partied from one place to the next. Like, the party would follow them. Like, a group of people would go and they'd hang out in one place, and they'd do that for 20 minutes, and then they'd go and hang out at another place.

I thought, "Wouldn't that be fun if we did that just with our friends, and did it in order to swap and exchange stuff that we no longer needed at our respective homes." Look, we all look in our homes and we go, "There are 10 things here that I don't use anymore, that I don't need." If you happen to have kids there may be things that your kids don't use anymore, or your kids don't need. If you happen to be a sports fan there may be equipment that you don't use anymore. "Hey, I'm not golfing as much as I used to anymore."

There are things in all of our homes that we don't want or we don't need, and so it's a great way of getting together with five or six friends, scheduling it on a Saturday, and going to each other's houses where you put everything that you don't want in your living room, and it becomes a virtual shopping spree.

Bobbi Rebell:
I love, first of all, that it's social, and I love, also, it's always delicate, because when you want to gift to somebody something that maybe you don't need anymore it's an awkward thing to give them something that you don't want. Because it's kind of like, "Oh, you're giving me your leftovers." But if you just put it there and they can just decide to take it, then it takes away that sort of negativity and makes it a positive thing.

Tanya Van Court:
It absolutely does. I think it makes it a positive thing for everyone, like, you're super happy to get rid of it, but they're super happy to get it.

Financial Grownup tip #1:

One things Tanya mentioned that stood out is that, while she lost money that she had on paper, I know it still hurts a lot, others had leveraged against their stockings and lost so much more. In addition to her advice to diversify, we also want to be very careful when borrowing against actual assets. Do not over leverage.

Financial Grownup tip #2:

This holiday season take it a step further than what Tanya was talking about. Think carefully about the physical stuff that you are buying for other people, not just children. Unwanted gifts are a total waste of money. There are so many new ways that technology is allowing us to give differently. Apps like Goalsetter are great, especially for kids that have too much stuff. But when you want to send a physical gift, and sometimes this is even for business purposes, there are new services, like, GiftNow. That's my personal new favorite that I'm obsessed with.

Basically, the way that one works is that instead of a boring gift certificate you virtually send someone a specific gift from a retailer to their email, so you don't need their physical address, you don't have to send them an email asking where should I send this, who will receive it, blah, blah, blah. It opens in a virtual gift box, and they can select their size, so you don't have to be guessing. They can change the color, if you don't know what color they want. They can even exchange it all before it gets delivered, so you don't have the whole hassle of the return and all that stuff.

I just used it for my friends' baby's one year birthday. It was so great to not have to carry a gift to the party, not worrying about it getting lost in the pile, and to know that my friend could swap it out without me even knowing it, not worrying if she would hurt my feelings, if she didn't love the fabulous dress that I got her daughter.

Then again, you can never have too many little frilly little girl dresses, right? I'm sure it was a huge hit.

EPISODE LINKS

Check out Tanya's company GoalSetter here!

Tanya Van Court is on Shark Tank!

Follow Tanya!

Instagram: @tvancourt

Linked In: @Tanya Van Court

Twitter: @tvancourt

Follow Goalsetter!

Instagram: @goalsetterco

Twitter: @goalsetterco

Facebook: @goalsetterco

Learn more about GiftNow

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

3 Student Loan Tips

• What an Income Driven Repayment plan is and why you should look into applying for this

• The benefits and drawbacks of refinancing student loans

• Taking advantage of PSLF (Public Service Loan Forgiveness)

Episode Links:

The website for David’s book - www.studentloansolutionbook.com

David's book Student Loan Solution

Davids website - www.youngadultmoney.com

Follow David!

Twitter - @DavidCarlson1

Instagram - @David_Carlson

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

When Lee Huffman needed to visit his mom while she was receiving treatment for cancer, his car broke down and he had to get a new one immediately. But without steady income, he could have been out of luck, if it weren't for one key thing he had going for him. 

In Lee's money story you will learn:

• The perks, as well as the setbacks, from being self employed

• What he decided to do when his trusty truck became not so trusty anymore while he was on his way to see his mother who was having surgery for breast cancer

• Why he decided that a new car was better than just fixing his old truck

• The problem he ran into with banks when trying to get a loan

• How his great relationship with Bank of America and his great credit score helped him to get approved for a car loan

“Because I have taken really good care of my credit.. I was able to get approved for a loan with almost the lowest rate I was able to find anywhere"

In Lee’s money lesson you will learn:

• How your credit score can be a very valuable asset and can actually create opportunities for you

“Focus on your credit score.  It can be a wonderful asset that can open a lot of doors of opportunity for you”

In Lee's everyday money tip you will learn:

• The importance of having local currency when traveling. If you don't have the local currency, you can stop by an ATM. Some banks don't charge the fee to use another bank's ATM or simply reimburse you for it later

"Before you start earning miles in any of the different airline programs make sure that those miles are going to get you to the place you want to go to"

In My Take you will learn:

• How you can avoid paying for water in the airport by bringing a metal water bottle with you when you travel in airports- but remember to keep them empty

• Lee talked about how he loves using credit cards to get miles and free stuff. All good. But don’t go too crazy with that. You do you. If you don't travel much, you may want to look into a credit card that offers different kinds of rewards

Episode Links:

Lee's podcast We Travel There

Lee's free email course "7 days to your dream vacation"

Check out Lee's websites -

www.BaldThoughts.com

www.WeTravelThere.com

Follow Lee at BaldThoughts!

• Instagram - @BaldThoughts

• LinkedIn - @LeeRHuffman

• Twitter - @BaldThoughts

• Facebook - @BaldThoughts

• Pinterest - @BaldThoughts

Follow Lee at We Travel There!

• Instagram - @WeTravelThere

• Twitter - @WeTravelThere

• Facebook - @WeTravelThere

When Lee Huffman needed to visit his mom while she was receiving treatment for cancer, his car broke down and he had to get a new one immediately. But without steady income, he could have been out of luck, if it weren't for one key thing he had going for him. In this Financial Grownup podcast episode Lee tells us how he was able to get approved for a car loan when he needed it and shares how we can save money while traveling. #TravelTips #TravelHacks

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Transcription

Lee Huffman:
I was about 90 minutes into the drive, and my check engine light started flashing and flashing and flashing at me. I had to turn around, and I was really upset that I wasn't gonna be able to be there for my mom.

Bobbi Rebell:
You're listening to Financial Grownup with me, certified financial planner Bobbi Rebell, author of How to Be a Financial Grownup. You know what? Being a grownup is really hard, especially when it comes to money. But it's okay. We're gonna get there together. I'm gonna bring you one money story from a financial grownup, one lesson, and then my take on how you can make it your own. We got this.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey, friends. That was our guest, in a bit of a panic because his car was breaking down while he was on his way to visit his mom, who was battling cancer. He needed a new car immediately, but he had just started a business. And as you guys are probably already guessing, as I say this, he had no proof of income, because he didn't necessarily know what his income would be. He did not have a W-2 job. So, the loan to buy that car that he needed was not a sure thing. We're gonna get to how that story evolved in just a moment, but first a welcome to everyone. New listeners, thank you for checking us out. Please subscribe so you don't miss any future episodes. Make sure to do the custom settings. If you're using iTunes, set it to auto download, so you don't miss any episodes, as I said. And if you have a moment, I'd love to know how you found us. DM me on Instagram at BobbiRebell1, or on Twitter, @BobbiRebell. Our email is hello@financialgrownup.com.

Bobbi Rebell:
Now to our guest. He is Lee Huffman. You may know him from his blog and YouTube channel, Bald Thoughts, his podcast, We Travel There, which I love because it's all interviews with locals for places that we travel to, so you get the local perspective. All right. If you are self-employed, or you dream of being self-employed, or you know anyone who is self-employed, you have to listen to this man's story, and then the advice that comes from it. Plus, his everyday money tip that's gonna be at the end is going to save all of us a lot of wasted cash when we travel abroad. So, stick with us to the end. Here is Lee Huffman.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey, Lee Huffman. You're a financial grownup. Welcome to the podcast.

Lee Huffman:
It's great to be here.

Bobbi Rebell:
I am a huge fan of all of your many channels of information about travel. You are the man behind Bald Thoughts, "Travel More. Spend Less. Live Better," the podcast, We Travel There, and of course, you also have a budding YouTube channel, and probably a ton more stuff I don't even know about you yet. But I'm so happy you're here, Lee.

Lee Huffman:
Yeah. It's great to be here, and I'm looking forward to meeting all your listeners. I've listened to a lot of your episodes. It's really good information.

Bobbi Rebell:
Well, thank you. You provide a lot of great information, and not to ... I do want to also mention, by the way, you do this now full-time. But by the way, you left a $200,000 a year job to do this, so this is something you are truly passionate about. Writing about not just travel, but also early retirement, credit cards, insurance, lots of personal finance topics. For your money story today, though, we're going to be talking about travel, and how that led to an important credit card related experience. Go for it, Lee.

Lee Huffman:
Sure. Like you mentioned, I left my corporate job. That has a lot of pluses and minuses, right? This was a situation where it was a little scary, and a little bit of a rough situation. So, my mom battled breast cancer, and she beat it the first time about a decade ago. And unfortunately, the breast cancer came back recently. One of the benefits of me quitting my job and moving from California to Nashville is that I'm a short drive away. Well, short is eight hours, but it's a lot closer than California.

Lee Huffman:
She was going in for surgery. I said, "You know what? Being now not having to sit in front of a desk, that can work from anywhere. I'm just gonna go and spend some time with her." So I said, "Okay. I'm gonna drive my truck." And like a true financial grownup, I've had this truck for almost a decade. I stopped paying payments on it several years ago, and pretty excited about that. However, my truck had other ideas. So, I was about 90 minutes into the drive, and my check engine light started flashing and flashing and flashing at me. I'm like, "Oh, no."

Bobbi Rebell:
Oh, no. Oh, no.

Lee Huffman:
Yes.

Bobbi Rebell:
That's never good.

Lee Huffman:
Yeah. Check engine light on? Bad. Check engine light flashing? It's like, "Hey, stupid. Stop driving. Something really bad is going on right now." And so, I talked with my wife, and I had to turn around. And I was really upset that I wasn't gonna be able to be there for my mom, but I also didn't want to break down halfway in the middle of the mountains someplace.

Lee Huffman:
So, I came back. Went to the repair shop, and basically the guy told me that the repairs were gonna be worth more than what the actual truck was worth. I was like, "Okay, that's not good. It's time to get a new truck."

Bobbi Rebell:
And by the way, it should be noted ... So, now you have to buy a new car, but you are self-employed, and that makes things a lot more complicated.

Lee Huffman:
Absolutely. Because banks are really weird when they actually want proof of income, because they want you to be able to pay the loan back. Right?

Bobbi Rebell:
Well, that's not so weird, Lee. Let's be fair. That's not so weird.

Lee Huffman:
I know.

Bobbi Rebell:
I want to know, if I lend someone money, that they can pay it back.

Lee Huffman:
Exactly, exactly.

Bobbi Rebell:
[inaudible 00:05:31].

Lee Huffman:
Yeah. So, I reached out to several different banks. Credit unions are usually some of the best to get car loans from, because they offer really good rates, and every one of them wanted at least two years' worth of tax returns, to be able to prove the income. But I had just left my job less than a year ago, and so my last two years of tax returns are not representative of what my situation is today. And so, I couldn't get approved.

Lee Huffman:
But luckily, because I've taken really good care of my credit, and I've really focused on keeping a high credit score for a lot of the travel stuff that I do, with the credit cards and miles and points, and the relationship that I've had with Bank of America over the last almost two decades, then I was actually able to get approved for a loan, with almost the lowest rate that I was able to find anywhere, and all based on keeping a good credit score. So luckily, long story short, I was able to get approved for the car loan, and able to get a new car almost in an instant, without any paperwork, any proof of income, based on having a 760-plus FICO score.

Bobbi Rebell:
And you were able to visit your mom, right?

Lee Huffman:
Yeah. She's doing really well now, and recovering, and back to her old ornery self.

Bobbi Rebell:
Okay. All right. Let's just move on from there, Lee. So, what is your lesson for our listeners from that story?

Lee Huffman:
Really, the main thing is that your credit score is one of your most valuable assets, that you can easily mess up. You know, missing payments, maxing out your credit cards, those type of things. But as long as you focus on your credit score and do the right things with your credit, it can be a wonderful asset, that can open a lot of doors of opportunity for you.

Bobbi Rebell:
I love the way you phrase that, because it's so positive. A lot of people think about their credit score as something that they're almost playing defense with, that it can stop you from getting things. But you talk about the opportunity that it creates.

Lee Huffman:
Absolutely. I mean, like you said, I focus on a lot of travel. I travel the world with my wife and children, and it's mostly free, using all the miles and points that I earn from the credit cards, all based on my credit score.

Bobbi Rebell:
Let's talk about your everyday money tip, because that also has to do with travel and being able to maximize your spending there, by not paying more than you have to when you change money. Or maybe not paying anything.

Lee Huffman:
Exactly.

Bobbi Rebell:
What's your everyday money tip, Lee?

Lee Huffman:
Exactly. When you're traveling, it pays to make sure that you have some local currency when you're going to foreign countries. Unfortunately, when you go through the airport or some of these other places, they want to give you money at a really bad exchange rate. So, you want to use an ATM machine from a bank, so you can get the money at the best exchange rate possible. However, ATMs also like to charge you a lot of fees. Luckily, there are a lot of banks now that offer one, the debit card that does not charge you a fee for using other people's ATMs. And then, some banks also actually reimburse you the fees that are charged by other banks.

Lee Huffman:
So I've been using, for the last probably decade or so, Charles Schwab. I'm not affiliated with them or anything like that, but I kind of keep them in my back pocket. I don't use them for every day, but I kind of have money go into that account every month. That way when I travel, I have a little bit of a slush fund, that I can withdraw money from ATM, anywhere around the world, and not have to worry about fees, and always getting the best exchange rates.

Bobbi Rebell:
Which gives you more money, ultimately, to spend on your traveling the world, and fun in foreign countries with your family. So, that's an amazing tip, and great for all of us. Let's talk more about what is going on at Bald Thoughts and We Travel There. You also have a new project that is coming out, and it's Seven Days to Your Dream Vacation. I already planned my spring break, so I'm upset I didn't get to this before then. But I'll be able to use it for the next one. Tell us about that.

Lee Huffman:
Absolutely. So, Seven Days to Your Dream Vacation is a free email course that basically walks you through the process of finding a location, being able to pick out the hotels and airlines, and finding ways to reduce those costs using airline miles and hotel points, so that way you can travel for as free as possible.

Bobbi Rebell:
What would be an example? Give us a little sneak peek.

Lee Huffman:
Sure. Kind of like the Stephen Covey book. You know, Begin With the End in Mind? I love Southwest Airlines. They're one of my favorite airlines in the U.S.. However, if you want to go to Europe, or you want to go to South America, Asia, they're not gonna get you there. So, one of the most important things. Before you start earning miles in any of the different airline programs, make sure that those miles are gonna get you to the places you want to go to.

Bobbi Rebell:
In other words, be thoughtful, think ahead, and then you'll be in a better position when you finally are ready to take that trip.

Lee Huffman:
Absolutely.

Bobbi Rebell:
Tell us more about where can people learn more about you and your blog and your podcast, and everything you're up to, Lee.

Lee Huffman:
Sure, sure.

Bobbi Rebell:
So many things.

Lee Huffman:
Exactly. Bald Thoughts is all about airline miles, hotel points, trip reports, the latest in credit cards. So if you want to learn about miles and points, that's the place to go, there. Then, the podcast is called We Travel There, and it's all about having local interviews with people from around the world, to find out the best things to do in their city. Basically, I've always traveled, and whenever I do, I meet people. And I always [inaudible 00:10:44] their ear a little bit, and say, "Hey. What are some of the things that locals like to do here?" Essentially, the podcast allows you to be in on that conversation, so that way you can plan your next trip, or be inspired to go to some place that you may never have thought of.

Bobbi Rebell:
Well, you are certainly very inspiring. I hope we all get to travel to our dream destinations. Thank you, Lee.

Lee Huffman:
Thank you very much.

Bobbi Rebell:
Let's do this. Financial Grownup tip number one. Lee talked about travel. I want to add one more tip from him, that came up after we finished recording our interview. It's something that a lot of us kind of know to do, but we all could use a reminder, myself included, and that is to think about water. Think about water when you're traveling, because when you go through security, they're gonna take the water bottles that you may bring with you. Hopefully you'll remember to dispose of them before you go through security, but they're not coming through. So bring those metal ones or glass bottles that you can fill with water once you get past security, so you can avoid buying those super expensive water bottles once you're past security, because you know that's not a good place to be spending your money. Nobody wants to pay five dollars, sometimes even more, for water, especially when there's water fountains around. But especially if you have kids, or you just want to be able to carry the water with you, and not have to go back and forth to the fountain, bring those water bottles and fill them up.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownup tip number two. This is a bit controversial. Lee talked about how he loves using credit cards to get miles and free stuff. That's all good, but it's really important not to go crazy with that. It makes a lot of headlines. People talk a big game about how much free stuff they're getting. But the truth is, miles reward cards aren't the best for everyone. The best one for you may be a cash back card, or some other kind of reward card tied to your interests and need. Or maybe you have to carry a balance. This is a no judgment zone. So, maybe you just need to focus on the one that's gonna have the lowest interest rate. Don't get caught up in the travel rewards hype. Do what's right for you.

Bobbi Rebell:
Before we head out, I want to invite you guys to check out my new podcast with my friend Joe Saul-Sehy. You may know him from the Stacking Benjamins Podcast. Our podcast is called Money in the Morning. We share news headlines, we break down why they matter, and how you can use the lessons in your own life. And here's the best part of the podcast, and why we're having so much fun, and why I want you guys to join us. That is because we tape Money in the Morning live, in front of a Facebook Live audience. So, go to Facebook.com/istackbenjamins. That is the Stacking Benjamins Facebook page. Facebook.com/istackbenjamins. Set up an alert for live tapings. Join us. Insider secret, by the way, guys ... We do a lot of giveaways. So, I hope to see you guys there. Again, come with your comments, get ready to participate, and maybe your comment will get read on the air, and you'll be part of our podcast at Money in the Morning.

Bobbi Rebell:
Big thanks to Bald Thoughts' Lee Huffman, for helping us all get one step closer to being financial grownups.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownup with Bobbi Rebell is edited and produced by Steve Stewart, and is a BRK Media production.

Health insurance is expensive but fitness coach and author Liz Josefsberg learned there are ways to lower your cost, and to make sure you are getting what you need at the same time. Plus her every day money tip to go to every restaurant you love, order what you want, and still reach your health goals. 

In Liz's money story you will learn:

• The things she learned about buying her own health insurance when she left Weight Watchers after being there for 11 years

• Why she says that buying your own health insurance it's not as hard or scary as it seems

• Why she was grateful to live a healthy lifestyle when looking at health insurance for herself

• The reason she was able to get a lower health insurance rate because she was so healthy

• How being healthy helped her to save more money than people her same age due to her lifestyle

In Liz’s money lesson you will learn:

• How changing your health is easier than people make it to be

• How making small shifts can make the biggest impact on your health

In Liz's everyday money tip you will learn:

• How you can figure out a weight loss program that will work for your lifestyle

• The tip she suggests to those that eat out more often than most due to meetings with clients

In My Take you will learn:

• Let’s talk about working out. I love a $35 boutique fitness class as much as the next person (or maybe you don’t) but that is expensive and for a lot of us. Instead see if they offer a streaming option, which may be a fraction of the cost.

• Find the technology that works for you- and you may already have it

Episode Links:

Liz's book Target 100

Cosmo piece- 14 Fitness Apps that Make exercise suck less

Bustle piece- 6 apps that can help you drink more water

Check out Liz's website -

www.lizjosefsberg.com

Follow Liz!

• Instagram - @LizJosefsberg

• Pinterest - @LizJosefsberg

• Twitter - @LizJosefsberg

• Facebook - @LizJosefsbergWeightLoss

• LinkedIn - @LizJosefsberg

Health insurance is expensive but fitness coach and author Liz Josefsberg learned there are ways to lower your cost, and to make sure you are getting what you need at the same time. Plus her every day money tip to go to every restaurant you love, order what you want, and still reach your health goals. In this Financial Grownup podcast episode you’ll learn how to invest in you! #InvestInYou #Fitness Coach #Author

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Transcription

Liz Josefsberg:
I was able to get a lower health insurance bill because I was so healthy. Just being a healthy person saves you so much money.

Bobbi Rebell:
You're listening to Financial Grownup, with me, certified financial planner Bobbi Rebell, author of How To Be A Financial Grownup, and you know what? Being a grownup is really hard, especially when it comes to money. But it's okay, we're going to get there together. I'm going to bring you one money story from a financial grownup, one lesson, and then my take on how you can make it your own. We got this.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hello, my financial grownup friends, we are talking health and wellness here on the Financial Grownup podcast, because you gotta have those if you want to be wealthy in the end. Very excited to share this interview with this woman that I have come to adore. Her name is Liz Josefsberg, she is a health, wellness and weight loss expert. She has worked with so many big names, everyone, including Jessica Simpson, Jennifer Hudson, who is on The Voice, love her. Katie Couric, personal idol of mine, I think she is amazing, and Charles Barkley. All of whom she talks about in her latest book, Target 100. And by the way, the love is mutual, they all endorse her as well.

Bobbi Rebell:
Welcome everyone, and to our new listeners, thank you for checking us out. We keep the shows on the shorter side, but they are designed to stack together to fit whatever amount of time you have available. Make your own playlist. With that, let's get some great advice from Liz, who after leaving her corporate job at Weight Watchers, started her own business, and like millions of people had to go shopping for health insurance on her own for the very first time. Here is Liz Josefsberg.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey, Liz Josefsberg, you're a financial grownup, welcome to the podcast.

Liz Josefsberg:
Great to be here, thanks for having me.

Bobbi Rebell:
For those of our listeners who aren't already fans of yours, you are a very well known weight loss expert. You are the author of Target 100, the world's simplest weight loss program in six easy steps, foreword by non other than Jennifer Hudson, and as a lot of our listeners know, I always love to talk about the connection between health and wealth. So I'm so happy to have you.

Liz Josefsberg:
I'm so glad to be here.

Bobbi Rebell:
And before we get into your money story, I do want to talk just a little bit about the book. Right here on the front page it is a who's who of people that are famous for getting in shape, and you were their coach. People like Jessica Simpson, Charles Barkley, Katie Couric, Dr. Oz, Rocco DiSpirito, the famous chef. Pretty cool stuff.

Liz Josefsberg:
Yeah. I've had a great, great career and I'm very lucky to work with amazing, amazing people, and I love all those guys, but I would say standing behind those famous names are thousands of people, thousands of everyday moms, dads, working people, and even myself, having lost 65 pounds.

Bobbi Rebell:
Right. You lost that weight and then you went on to work at Weight Watchers where you were really a brand ambassador for them and working with all these celebrities, but then it came time for you to go out on your own, and that was a big life transition, and you had to make some big financial grownup choices of your own. One of which, and this is a big one, is for the first time in your life you had to buy your own health insurance.

Liz Josefsberg:
Yeah.

Bobbi Rebell:
So that is your money story. So tell us, what happened? You leave Weight Watchers, and suddenly you're starting your own company, what do you do? Where do you begin, and what was that like?

Liz Josefsberg:
I have to say, that was one of the scariest parts. You work for a big corporation, and I was there for 11 years, I played all these roles, and the corporation takes care of everything for you. It's like they're leading you through it, there aren't that many choices, and then I was very intentional about wanting to start my own company and wanting to get out on my own, but that was one of the things that held me back for some time actually. So I'm here to say that once you do go out into the world and buy your own health insurance, it's not as scary as it seems, so don't let it hold you back.

Bobbi Rebell:
Tell us what actually happened. So you realized you had to do this, where do you even begin, for people that have never had to do this, and what was it like?

Liz Josefsberg:
Yeah. So, I was lucky because the marketplace was open that year. It was the first time it had ever opened, so things weren't going smoothly, I will give you that. It was crashing all the time, if you remember. So I started there and I started just researching a bunch of different plans, and looking at different levels of what did I actually need? Because my husband is an actor, he has a union, and he has life insurance and health insurance through there, and I just was, it's just for me, not for my kids. Just for me as a solo person, I don't have a big corporation.

Liz Josefsberg:
So I started to think about what did I actually need, and I think this was one of those moments where I was so grateful that I did live a healthy lifestyle and I was a healthy person, because I felt like I looked through things like what a bronze level was, and what a silver level, and what a gold level was, and what those comparisons were between different companies, and what I would be getting, and what my deductibles would be. And I was just grateful that I was able to get a lower health insurance bill because I was so healthy.

Liz Josefsberg:
I would say as a part of what I do, I'm always encouraging people to think about where and how just being a healthy person saves you so much money.

Bobbi Rebell:
And just to ask this, I feel a little silly that maybe this is obvious, but when you say you got a lower rate because you were healthier, do you go in and get an exam and get told, "Oh, you're at low risk for all of these things, so we'll give you a better rate," or are you just self diagnosing and saying, "Well, I'm going to go on the bronze plan, not the silver plan, because I feel more comfortable with that because I think the odds of me having something more serious are low."

Liz Josefsberg:
Do you know what? I did two things hand in hand. I did go to my general practitioner and have a check up to just reinstate and recheck my blood sugar levels, things like that. I was pretty confident that I was a healthy person, but I wanted to make sure first. I also looked back and did a little bit of a self audit about how often am I going to the doctor? I knew I wanted to be covered for anything catastrophic, but honestly I get sick, if even, I'm knocking on some wood right now, but if even once a year, and usually some little cold.

Liz Josefsberg:
That was my 'aha' moment. I go for my general checkups, I get my mammograms, I want those things to be covered, but I don't have a lot of need because I'm really taking great care of myself, and I would say that some of that money that I save on health insurance, I definitely spend on healthcare for myself. I spend it on supplements that I believe in, I spend it on gym memberships, and athletic clothing, and all the things that keep me healthy, but it's much less than I would be spending.

Bobbi Rebell:
I love the idea that you did this health audit of looking back at the actual healthcare services and products that you were actually using, because a lot of us don't necessarily pay deliberate attention to that the way we do with our finances. So we have all these software programs that we use to analyze where our money is going, but you were analyzing where your healthcare spending was going, and broadening that, not just to the actual medical bills, but also to things that improved your health, and really taking a tactical approach when making this ... How much you pay for health insurance can be a huge part of your financial budget.

Liz Josefsberg:
Yes. I'm probably spending about a third as much of a lot of the people that I've heard in my age range are spending, and that is because I feel so confident that with my lifestyle, and the lifestyle that I've created even in my book, which it's not really just about your weight, it's about the hours of sleep that I get, it's about the stress relief that I believe in, it's about my hydration levels, it's about my exercise and my movements. So not just getting to the gym, but how much I walk, how many steps I get in a day, and then about my nutrition as well.

Liz Josefsberg:
So I feel very confident having built a life of healthy habits, that this would be the right amount of coverage for me, and I think thinking about those things of, "Okay, how could I lower my health insurance bills? I could really investigate the habits in my life that are making me get sick more often, that are making me less strong and stable, so that I am falling and breaking things." All of those things that are going to cost you so much more in the long run than taking care of yourself in a gentle way. And I'm not talking crazy change your life kind of ways, but the simplest things like staying hydrated keep my immune system running at its optimum levels. 75% of America is critically, critically dehydrated.

Liz Josefsberg:
So I'm always talking about simple shifts that are going to pay major, major dividends.

Bobbi Rebell:
So what is the lesson for our listeners here then, what's the take away?

Liz Josefsberg:
I really encourage people to make the small shifts that give the biggest impact. So I keep coming back to hydration because it's such a great example. If you are critically dehydrated, all of your systems aren't running well. So learning and triggering the habit of drinking water is a perfect example of how you can change your health outcomes and change your life with a simple shift.

Bobbi Rebell:
And speaking of which, that brings us to our everyday money tip, and this has to do with a client of yours.

Liz Josefsberg:
Yeah. I'm all about people living and having a weight loss program that actually fits in their life. So this particular client lives in New York, he has to dine out a lot, most days he's eating out, and he didn't want to give that piece up because he can't really. So we looked at his life, and he was talking about wanting to go out for Chinese food, and I said, "What you're ordering isn't bad at all, it's the amount that you're ordering. So instead I want you to sit down, I want you to order what you like, I want you to ask them for a to go box, put half of it in and have that for lunch the next day." So my everyday money tip is, you can get two meals out of one. You can split that price right down the middle and save a ton of money, and lose weight at the same time, by just splitting those portions. Always do it upfront, because if you leave it on the plate you might not be able to stop yourself from eating it.

Bobbi Rebell:
That last part is key. Alright, let's talk about your business and Target 100. There's so many things that I like about this, one of which is that you talk about sample eating plans. That's one of the first major chapters of it, but then you say, but this is my eating plan and that doesn't mean it's right for you.

Liz Josefsberg:
That's where I saw long term success living. Wasn't if you blindly follow somebody else's meal plan, because maybe you don't like kale and quinoa, it doesn't mean you can't lose weight.

Bobbi Rebell:
Right, and you talk about how certain celebrities, like Jennifer Hudson, had trouble with that. They were on these different plans but they couldn't stick to it.

Liz Josefsberg:
Jennifer was terrified. She loves chicken wings, that's one of her favorite foods, and sushi too, and she swore off of those. I was like, "You don't need to swear off of those." I said, "But hey, when you get out and you want to have the chicken wings, you've got to start with a salad to fill yourself up, then get a half order instead." So it's not about not having, it's about the management of.

Bobbi Rebell:
And portion control. Then the final thing I want to touch on is technology, that you're really pro technology.

Liz Josefsberg:
I am pro technology. I think about this as there are of course Fitbits, but there are also these amazing technologies. These scales that wirelessly upload to your phone and they give you all these outputs of not just your weight, but your body fat. There are connected water bottles that tell you how much water you've had during the day, and ping you to remind you to drink the water. There are incredible breath analysis technologies now that can tell us if we're actually in ketosis, if you wanted to be on a keto diet, just by analyzing particles in your breath. So there are incredible moves forward that are happening in technology, or just take Peloton.

Bobbi Rebell:
Yes.

Liz Josefsberg:
You've got this amazing technology that's creating community and inspiring people, and gamifying exercise in a way that we know those are the things that are going to move the needle on obesity. It's really about accountability, support, and gamification. Technology is going to single handedly be the thing that turns the tide on this thing.

Bobbi Rebell:
Love it all. Where can people get in touch with you and learn more about all of this?

Liz Josefsberg:
You can look me up on all platforms, Instagram, Facebook, Linkedin, you name it, as Liz Josefsberg, and it's J-O-S-E-F-S-B-E-R-G, and or you can look up the book at Target 100 program on all the platforms as well.

Bobbi Rebell:
Finally, one thing I love about the book is, I feel like I read this but now I'm going to go back and do the worksheets and really go through it. This is a library book, it's not a book you read and then give away. You keep it and make it part of your plan to be healthier. So thank you, Liz.

Liz Josefsberg:
Thank you.

Bobbi Rebell:
Okay my friends, here we go. Financial Grownup tip number one, let's talk about working out and let's be honest here. I love a great $35 boutique fitness class as much as the next person, maybe you don't, but a lot of us do, if we're being honest. But if we're also being honest about the cost, it is really expensive and to some degree not really the best use of our money all the time. Maybe a treat, maybe you get it on a discount site. I use Gilt a lot sometimes, G-I-L-T, but for a lot of us it's really not necessarily the best option all the time, and also it's winter, and for some of us that live in colder climates, we're just not motivating to leave the house all that much.

Bobbi Rebell:
The solution; pick your favorite kind of boutique class and see if they offer a streaming option, or if there's a similar class that does. And remember, obviously you might like your local place, but if you're going online and you're looking for streaming options, the sky's the limit. You are not limited to local, you could go everywhere, and if you're looking for other ideas, you don't know where to start, Class Pass now offers free workouts. Look for Class Pass Go, it is an app, and at least for now, it's free.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownup tip number two; find the technology that works for you, and you may already have it by the way. It could be on your phone and you just haven't noticed it. For example, if you have an iPhone there's a health app built right in, and you know what? It tracks a lot of things. What I use it for is my steps, and it's great because I will forget about it for the longest time, and then I'll check it, and because I live in New York city and we walk a lot here, I usually get a nice surprise in terms of how many steps I have actually been doing throughout my week.

Bobbi Rebell:
Another one that a lot of people love is My Fitness Pal, which I just downloaded and I'm going to be trying it out, if anyone there has feedback or suggestions for me about My Fitness Pal. Other ones to check out include Health Out, this one is interesting because it puts together restaurants in your area that have healthy menu items, so it actually gives you those options, and then done, which is about habit building.

Bobbi Rebell:
Liz also in the interview, as you remember, stressed hydration. Another thing that I working on, and probably a lot of you, because we always should be drinking more water. A couple apps to try out for that include Water Time, Mobile Creatures, we'll leave links to all of these in the show notes, which rewards you with adorable creatures like cute cats. The other one Drink Water Reminder, great names, they really get to the point. Drink Water Reminder, which will give you a nudge to drink water at set times throughout the day, and by the way the show notes are always at BobbiRebell.com/financialgrownuppodcast and find them there, you could also look at the bottom of the notes, if you're listening in an app, and there'll be a link right there. The other format is BobbiRebell.com/podcast/ and then the guest's name.

Bobbi Rebell:
And of course, I need to know what your favorite fitness, health, and hydration apps are. So please send them to me, you can DM @BobbiRebell1 at Instagram, @BobbiRebell on Twitter, or you could email us hello@financialgrownup.com, and we will then share them with the rest of the listeners through the show notes. Maybe I'll share them on social media as well. Big thanks to Liz Josefsberg for her healthy tips to help us all live our richest lives, and for helping us all get closer to being financial grownups.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownup with Bobbi Rebell is edited and produced by Steve Stewart and is a BRK media production.

Do Spring Break like a Financial Grownup! Amazing tips from guest co-host Lee Huffman, host of the We Travel There podcast which shares the locals perspective on destinations. Lee, who also writes the blog Bald Thoughts, shares 5 tips to save you money and let you focus on the fun.  

5 Spring Break Travel Tips

• Using miles and points to pay for flights and hotel is a no-brainer.

• The best ways to save money on airport parking

• Ways to save money on food while traveling

• Ways to save money on attractions

• How to keep your home safe while you're away

Episode Links:

Lee's free email course 7 Days to Your Dream Vacation

Lee's Websites

www.BaldThoughts.com

www.WeTravelThere.com

Follow Lee!

• Instagram @BaldThoughts

• Twitter @BaldThoughts

• Facebook @BaldThoughts

• Pinterest @BaldThoughts

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Millennial entrepreneur, podcaster, and author Nathan Latka shares how his love of pizza hut, his friends and willingness to put his money and savings where his mouth is got him what he wanted as a 5 year old child. Latka also previews his new book "How to Be A Capitalist Without Any Capital” and the strategies and systems that have grown his many ventures. 

In Nathan's money story you will learn:

• Why it's so important to let children make decisions

• Why he feels like his parents helped to make him an entrepreneur

• Why he feels like his success is due to his parents never telling him no (and when they did instead)

• What he learned at the age of 5 by being given the option between Pizza Hut for dinner or a sleep over with friends

In Nathan’s money lesson you will learn:

• Why he feels like the idea of only focusing on one thing isn't practical

In Nathan's everyday money tip you will learn:

• How you can use an app to book a hotel room for just a few hours during a day trip rather than spending money for an entire night

In My Take you will learn:

• Take 5 minutes each day this week and create a system for something that happens regularly

• By letting your children make choices- you empower them

Episode Links:

• Nathan's book How to be a Capitalist Without Any Capital

• Nathan's podcast The Top Entrepreneurs in Money, Marketing, Business and Life

• Recharge app for booking a stay for just a few hours

Check out Nathan's website -

www.NathanLatka.com

Follow Nathan!

• Instagram - @NathanLatka

• Twitter - @NathanLatka

• Facebook - @NathanWLatka

• LinkedIn - @NathanLatka

Millennial entrepreneur, podcaster, and author Nathan Latka shares how his love of pizza hut, his friends and willingness to put his money and savings where his mouth is got him what he wanted as a 5 year old child. Latka also previews his new book "How to Be A Capitalist Without Any Capital” and the strategies and systems that have grown his many ventures. In this Financial Grownup podcast episode you will learn a very important tip on how you can help to raise a successful child. #RaisingChildren #SuccessTips #Author

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Transcription

Nathan Latka:
You have to copy aggressively, and once you copy what your competitors have already paid to learn, right, you're getting free money there. They've already paid to learn it. Then you add your own twist at the end, and that's when people create a lot of success.

Bobbi Rebell:
You're listening to Financial Grownup with me, certified financial planner, Bobby Rebell. Author of How to Be a Financial Grownup, and you know what? Being a grownup is really hard, specially when it comes to money, but it's okay, we're gonna get there together. I'm gonna bring you one money story from a financial grownup, one lesson, and then my take on how you can make it your own. We got this.

Bobbi Rebell:
Controversial advice from our guest millennial entrepreneur, podcaster, and author, Nathan Latka. He is everywhere, so if you haven't heard of him yet, that's probably gonna change pretty fast. He is high energy and will get you motivated to make more money after listening to him. This guy is all about systems and strategies. Welcome all, so glad to have you here. As our returning listeners know, we talk to high achievers about key money related events in their life that played a role in growing up to be financial grownups. Lessons learned and simple everyday money tips you can use right away to make your life richer, all in around 15 minutes. Big treat today. Nathan Latka founded his first company at the ripe old age of 19 with just 119 dollars in the bank. He now considers himself retired, but I would question that given how much this now 29 year old has on his plate between his podcast, his new bestselling book, How to Be a Capitalist Without Any Capital, a TV show in development with CNBC that he's gonna tell us about, and oh, so much more, here is Nathan Latka.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey Nathan Latka, you're a financial grownup, welcome to the podcast.

Nathan Latka:
Bobbi, thank you for having me on.

Bobbi Rebell:
I am so excited because I have in my hand an early copy, and it may be out by the time this happens, of your new book, How to Be a Capitalist Without Any Capital: The Four Rules You Must Break to Get Rich. And let me tell you, I think you are the Tim Ferriss of your generation, that is a huge compliment because I'm a massive Tim Ferriss fan. So congratulations on the book.

Nathan Latka:
Well, we'll see what happens. The publisher, which is the biggest I think in the world, Random House, they go, "Nathan, we don't know if we like this book because it's not timeless. These strategies, you know, we can't sell a thousand of this book a decade from now." I'm going, "Yeah, it's urgent." The first person who purchases will have the biggest advantage because these things will not work five, 10 years from now. And this is true about life.

Bobbi Rebell:
You are very specific and a lot of the tools and methods that you talk about, and will even drop some names of some websites that I was not really aware of, are really awesome, some apps I should say. So for example, we were referencing the four hour work week, so it is very much of the moment, but I want to take a step back in time Nathan, to a story that you mentioned briefly in your book, but we are going to expand on, and it is your money story. So people know that I am a huge Cheesecake Factory fan, you were a fan of Pizza Hut. So we're gonna talk about Pizza Hut for your story. Go for it.

Nathan Latka:
I remember I was like five years old, we were in this blue mini van, my mom loved it, and we were driving home and I go, "Mom, dad, can we go to pizza tonight for dinner?" Which was like a treat for me, and I also had a sleep over coming up, and yeah, I think that weekend, where there was four or five playmates I had coming over, and both of these things obviously cost money. They're dinner or I had my friends over, my parents have to pay to feed all of them, and then take them home in the morning and clean up messes. So my mom basically wanted to say no to pizza hut or no to the sleepover, and so she gave me, instead of saying no to either, she just gave me a choice and said, "Nathan, you know you can either choose, we can either choose to do pizza tonight or do the sleepover, but we can't do both. Right, 'cause they both cost money." And I thought for a second in the backseat and then said back, "Mom, can I choose to get into my piggy bank and take us pizza out tonight?" And they laughed after that realizing what I was doing, and ultimately both decided to take us out to dinner and I still did the sleepover, but the lesson there is clear, which is, give your kids decisions, not answers.

Bobbi Rebell:
And also, you as a child wanted to find a solution, which in this case, and maybe you would not say this as an adult, was to tap your savings. Maybe as an adult you would let's say, try to up your income.

Nathan Latka:
Yeah, or all kinds of things, right? I mean, the trick is there, is you're not giving your children the answer, you're setting up a decision and you're teaching them to build that decision making muscle. This is very rare in today's world, in my opinion.

Bobbi Rebell:
So tell we, what is the takeaway for our audience there looking back? What did you learn and how does it apply to your life now?

Nathan Latka:
Well look, I mean, today I'm very different than I was when I was five years old, right? I mean, I have many, many different things going on, and so one of the things I talk about is, and I live this out every day is, there's a lot of people, in college for example, you're forced to essentially pick a major, right, when you're a sophomore, or you want to be forced into one thing. And this doesn't make a lot of sense to me, 'cause think about a bridge your going over, right, in your city. If it had one point of failure when the winds hit 20 miles per hour, you don't want to be going over that bridge, but a lot of us build our lives around a single point of failure. So the idea that you should only focus on one thing, and there's a lot of bestselling business books that sell this concept.

Bobbi Rebell:
I think there's actually a book called, The ONE Thing.

Nathan Latka:
The ONE Thing and Essentialism, because it sells. It's a really good story, and by the way, I love those guys. I know them all, but it's not practical, and that's because you never want a single point of failure. You want to always be throwing spaghetti noodles up the wall, you don't know which are gonna stick, and then when you see which ones stick, you double down on those.

Bobbi Rebell:
Let's talk about your everyday money tip, because this is something more and more people are traveling, we're not always working in an office, whether we're moving around, whether we work from home or we're going to see clients or traveling with our clients, and there is downtime, which can be wasted time.

Nathan Latka:
Yeah, so I travel a lot and like to be efficient, and I would usually, I'd always go to New York on day trips, and I used to have to buy a hotel room because when I landed at 7:00 or 8:00 or 9:00 AM in the morning, I had to go take a shower somewhere. I would leave the hotel room and only use it for four or five hours. It was a total waste of money for 300, 400 bucks. Now there's this app called Recharge which I use, where when you land in any city really, you can go on Recharge and book an amount of hours in a hotel room. So you go in, get some sleep, get a shower, do you makeup, do your hair, and get ready to go to that meeting.

Nathan Latka:
The old concept in this book is, the folks that are really wealthy in the world today, they climbed a certain ladder, and any time someone climbs a ladder to power or wealth, they then remove rungs from that ladder. They make it more complex so that no one else can climb it and challenge them. And so this group has sold us on four rules, and ultimately these are rules that you shouldn't believe that you must break, and we've talked about a few of them. The first, you don't want to focus on one thing, right? The second is, you should totally feel comfortable copying your competitors.

Bobbi Rebell:
Which has been used. To give examples in your book of how this has been used so successfully by some of the biggest companies in the world.

Nathan Latka:
But Bobbi, I bet your audience listening right now when they hear this, they're thinking, "Ugh, I feel dirty. It feels unethical. It feels slimy to copy my neighbor." I bet you they feel that. This is the problem with this tactic. People do this all the time 'cause it's smart, but humans, your natural emotion when you hear the word copy, is it feels bad. But here's, I mean, Facebook rips off every Snapchat feature, right? Steve Jobs went into the Xerox research lab and pulled a bunch of research out of there and basically copied that and that's what made the Lisa. That's what made the Mac and the iPhone and things like this. So you have to copy aggressively, and once you copy what your competitor has already paid to learn, you're getting free money there. They've already paid to learn it, then you add your own twist at the end, and that's where people create a lot of success.

Bobbi Rebell:
One of the things that I love about this book Nathan is the detail. You made a decision to put a lot of your own personal data out there. Tell me about that approach to writing this book.

Nathan Latka:
Yeah, I mean, it's very risky, right? Because the stuff will get old after four or five years, so again, this book is urgent. Say, you know, in page six I have my income statement and my tax return. My actual corporate tax return from 2013, where I was in my dorm room at 21, and we did 939,378 dollars in sales, and I started hiring my team. I put my board deck on page 35, and then I get into more personal finance stuff, right? Where I talk about how I used my very small Instagram following to get a free Rolls-Royce with an email striped on page 118. Or I used, how I did my first real estate deal, it was a 280 thousand dollar deal, where I only had to put essentially five grand down, and it [inaudible 00:08:31] 16 hundred dollars a month. That PNL is on page 149. So there's all kinds of examples here and there's not a big theme. They don't really connect. They're really individual stories that your audience can pick up, flip through and learn to drive their own side hustle and create some more financial independence.

Bobbi Rebell:
So what scares you? You have such wonderful confidence. You are how old now?

Nathan Latka:
29, just turned 29.

Bobbi Rebell:
The ripe old age of 29. What have you not done that you are hesitant about?

Nathan Latka:
Nothing really scares my in business, but I'll tell you what scares me in life. I don't know if anyone in your audience has ever gotten mono, but it basically knocks you out. You have to sleep.

Bobbi Rebell:
So it's your health.

Nathan Latka:
Well, no, no, no. Health is one thing, but let me be more specific. When you're laying in bed for seven days straight, and your brain is the brain of an entrepreneur, you actually start to go a little insane because your brain goes a million miles an hour in that quiet time, but your body can't keep up with it. So my biggest fear is I get to some point in life where my mind is still going a million miles an hour, but my body can't keep up and execute.

Bobbi Rebell:
We'll leave it there, but I want to hear from you. Where can people find out more about all of your ventures?

Nathan Latka:
Yeah, well we're excited. We just signed a TV deal with CNBC, which we didn't talk about. We're very excited about that. It is called Million Dollar Road Trip. So it will be like Shark Tank on the street, basically me walking up to random companies on the street, and in under 20 minutes or less flipping up my checkbook and buying the whole business or investing on the spot.

Bobbi Rebell:
It's kind of like a cross between The Profit and Shark Tank, and by the way, we've had both Barbara Corcoran and Kevin O'Leary on this podcast.

Nathan Latka:
Both great, love them both. So anyways, we're very excited. Again, this book guys, it'll get old. You can't wait. It's one of those things, like the first person who reads it has the biggest advantage. So you want to grab it now. You go to nathanlatka.com/book to get it, and the best way to stay in touch with me, I am on Twitter every day, I'm @NathanLatka. That's L-A-T-K-A.

Bobbi Rebell:
Thank you so much Nathan. This has been amazing.

Nathan Latka:
Bobbi thanks.

Bobbi Rebell:
Oh my gosh, Nathan's energy is contagious. Here we go. Financial grown up tip number one. Nathan is all about systems because he is at a point where things would literally fall apart almost instantly if he didn't have those systems in place, but for most of us, myself included, we can muddle by. So they're kind of haphazard because we don't have to have, but we would be so much better off if we had the right systems. And we know we'd be better off with them in place. Even something as simple as automatic reordering of coffee that we drink at home, that we make at home that we ran out of, but we don't have a system in place to reorder it, and then you know what happens. We go out to get the expensive coffee at the coffee shop, but we're too busy. So take five minutes each day this week, okay? Everyone do this. Take five minutes each day this week and create system for something small but that happens regularly, like the coffee. So if you run out of coffee all the time or you run out of whatever it is that you use on a regular basis, or it could be bill paying, bills that come every month, automate that. DM me on the socials and let me know what you did. I need ideas myself. On Instagram @bobbirebell1 and on Twitter @bobbirebell. You can also email at hello@financialgrownup.com.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownup tip number two. I love what Nathan learned from his parents that he talked about in his money story, because by not telling children what is happening when it comes to a money decision, but letting them make a choice, you empower them. This can apply to so many other situations in our personal lives and in our careers. Empower others to make decisions by giving them the specific options and the outcome that would happen based on the choice they make, and let them run with it.

Bobbi Rebell:
Okay everyone, Nathan's book is called How to Be a Capitalist Without Any Capital: The Four Rules You Must Break to Get Rich. It is an intense book everyone, but it is good. It is very specific. He literally gives you screen grabs of data that is very personal to him. I was a little shocked but he put it out there, and good for him, and good for us 'cause we learn from it. Go check it out along with his podcast The Top, and of course, big thanks to Nathan Latka for helping us all get one step closer to being financial grownups.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownup with Bobbi Rebell is edited and produced by Steve [Steward 00:12:57] and is a BRK Media production.

Happy Go Money author Melissa Leong shares the story of how her teen novels were rejected by mainstream publishers, but went on to sell over 70,000 copies after she decided to take control of her own career. Plus everyday social media tips to be happier no matter how much money you have or don’t have. 

“You can’t wait around to make the perfect amount of money. You can’t wait around for your boss to give you that raise for you to be happy.”

Melissa’s Money Story:

I tried to shop this around. It's a vampire series, during the time ... Well, it was the tail end of Twilight, so no publisher wanted another vampire book. So I got a lot of no’s, in which case I was faced with this decision of, what is my dream worth? I want to get this done, so what am I willing to invest in myself? So I created a budget of how much I would spend on, pay a designer to create a cover, to publish it myself, to put it out into the world.

I self-published it, and yes, it turned out, in more ways than one, to be a great, great experience, something that I consider a success in my life. Something that I could check off my bucket list. And I still get the occasional check in the mail, even though I don't do all that much work publicizing it. I did make my money back and then some, and it was basically a great gift that I could give to myself, just in terms of learning that I could build a brand, make money for myself outside of a salary, and take those tools and make more money in another career.

Bobbi Rebell:
Tell us more about the journey. Did you write it first, and then you went to different publishers? How did it actually work? And how did the economics change between, if you had gotten a deal with a traditional publisher versus your own situation where you were self-publishing? What did that actually involve from a business and an economic standpoint, and a marketing standpoint?

Melissa Leong:
I think people don't realize that when you go and you create any product, you are entering into a business. You're your own business. You're your own publisher. I learned so much about being my own marketing department, my own publishing, and quality control, and PR, and that all requires resources, time and money. So yeah, I didn't have a publisher to push my books, but because I was doing everything myself, I had full control, and I had a huge percentage of the cut of sales. A traditional publisher might give you 7% off of the book selling price, but say you publish through Amazon, you get 70%, depending on what you price the book at. That was really rewarding.

Bobbi Rebell:
I realize we were talking about PR for the book. We didn't say what the book title was, and where people can get it. We should say that, right?

Melissa Leong:
Yes. It's still on Amazon. The first book is called What Kills Me, and the second is I Am Forever. It's a teen adventure novel. It's based on a vampire story.

“Mute the people on social media who make you feel bad about yourself”

Melissa’s Money Lesson:

The same lesson that I have when it comes to happiness. I think we sit around waiting for external factors to fulfill us, and that's not how life will serve you best. You can't wait around to make the perfect amount of money. You can't wait around for your boss to give you that raise, for you to be happy. Happiness is for you to fulfill for yourself. It's the same thing with any of your goals or your dreams. They all seem lofty, and they all seem huge in the beginning, but you have to take that first step. You turn on the heat, and if you turn off the heat before the water boils, the water will never boil. You just have to keep going. You break everything down into some sort of small, bite-sized goal, like writing a 60,000-word book in six months. That was my goal, and I thought, "That is ridiculous. How am I going to do that?"

Well, I broke it down to the smallest thing. Every single day, five days a week, I have to write 500 words. There you go. If, by the end of the day, I haven't written 500 words of something for this novel, then I didn't feel good. I also had a partner who I could check in with, and say, "I met my goal today. Yay. Somebody keep me accountable." It was something very tangible to do in a very short period of time.

“I was faced with this decision. What is my dream worth? I want to get this done and so what am I willing to invest in myself”

Melissa’s Money Tip:

There is a study that shows that if you live beside somebody who's won the lottery, you are more apt to go bankrupt, because you're also spending on tangible, visible assets, even though you have not won any money. It is something that we beat ourselves up for, but it's something that you can control. You can put a tracker on your phone to see how much time you spend on social media. You can mute the people on social media who make you feel kind of jealous, who make you feel bad about yourself, who don't share your values. You can fill your feed with things that are uplifting, things that inspire you.

If you find yourself comparing yourself to other people, then choose what specific attributes that they have, that you admire. Don't admire somebody because they're rich. Admire them because they have some sort of tenacity, or some sort of perseverance quality that you think that you would like more of in your own life.

Bobbi’s Financial grownup tips:

Financial Grownup tip number one:

Inventory your stuff. We're not saying to do a Kon-Mari, reference to Marie Kondo, who is known for Tidying Up. Just know what you own, so you can make a decision about whether you want to own more. At least know what you have, so you don't make buying mistakes. So, for example, you don't buy something that you already have five of, you just didn't know where they were. And let's be honest, we've all done that. Make sure you know where your stuff is, so it's there for you when you need it.

Financial Grownup tip number two:

Again from Melissa's book, Happy Go Money: Delete your credit card info from the browser on your computer, your phone, iPad, whatever you use to shop, so you have to manually enter it each time you want to buy something. What I love about this advice is that it's not about buying something, whether you need it or just want it. That's okay. It is about creating a speed bump so you have to slow down and think about the decision, and make it a thoughtful one, and it's okay to buy things.

Episode Links:

• Blinkist - The app I’m loving right now. Please use our link to support the show and get a free trial.

• Melissa's book Happy Go Money

• Melissa’s website - www.MelissaLeong.com

Follow Melissa!

• Instagram - @LisLeong

• LinkedIn - @MelissaWLeong

• Twitter - @LisLeong

• Facebook - @Melissa.W.Leong

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Happy Go Money author Melissa Leong shares the story of how her teen novels were rejected by mainstream publishers, but went on to sell over 70,000 copies after she decided to take control of her own career. Plus everyday social media tips to be happier no matter how much money you have or don’t have. In this Financial Grownup podcast episode you’ll learn the things you can do to create your happiness. #Happiness #Author

Bobbi reveals her favorite new money books of the month, why she loves them and how to know if they are right for you. This month’s picks include The Dumb Things Smart People Do With Their Money. Thirteen Ways to Right Your Financial Wrongs by CBS News Business Analyst and Certified Financial Planner Jill Schlesinger,  Startup Money Made Easy: The Inc. Guide to Every Financial Question About Starting, Running and Grownup Your Business by Inc magazine Editor at Large Maria Aspan and Work Optional: Retire Early the Non-Penny Pinching Way by Our Next Life blogger and podcaster Tanja Hester.

Here are 3 money books that I truly enjoyed

• The Dumb Things Smart People Do with their Money. Thirteen Ways to Right Your Financial Wrongs by CBS News Business Analyst and Certified Financial Planner Jill Schlesinger

  • Jill's Financial Grownup episode

• Startup Money Made Easy: The Inc. Guide to Every Financial Question About Starting, Running and Grownup Your Business by Inc Magazine Editor at Large Maria Aspan

  • Maria's Financial Grownup episode

• Work Optional: Retire Early the Non-Penny Pinching Way by blogger and podcaster Tanja Hester

  • Tanja's Financial Grownup episode

Be sure to listen to the episode to learn if the book is for you!

Episode Links:

• Jill's website - Jill on Money

• Maria's website - Maria Aspan

• Tanja's website - Our Next Life

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Elisa Camahort Page and her BlogHer co-founders went two years without paying themselves a salary. She had the financial foundation to stick with the venture for that long thanks to conservative money habits she established well before deciding to be an entrepreneur. 

In Elisa's money story you will learn:

• How seeing her friends stuck in their jobs because of their mortgages helped Elisa to make a better decision on where to live

• The reason she decided to quit her job

• How budgeting and saving her money helped to put her into a position to pursue her dreams

• How she was able to not take a salary for herself for two years after starting her business

• The importance of really thinking about what she wanted to spend her money on

• Why she felt like it was important to spend money on experiences rather than things
  

In Elisa’s money lesson you will learn:

• Money doesn't buy happiness but it does buy you freedom

In Elisa's everyday money tip you will learn:

• Why she feels like having just one mentor isn't enough

• The importance that one of her mentors had on her by letting her sit in on calls and meetings that her position didn't require her to be there for

In My Take you will learn:

• Ask your boss if you can be in the room of meetings you may not be officially invited to join

• Prepare for the long term even if you don’t have any big picture goals

Check out Elisa's website -

www.elisacp.com

Follow Elisa!

• Instagram @ElisaCP

• LinkedIn - @ElisaCamahortPage

• Twitter - @ElisaC

• Facebook - @ElisaC

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Transcription

Elisa Camahort:
We didn't take a salary for two years, so I had put myself in a position to really pursue my dreams.

Bobbi Rebell:
You're listening to Financial Grownup. With me, certified financial planner, Bobbi Rebell, author of How to Be a Financial Grownup. You know what? Being a grownup is really hard, especially when it comes to money. But it's okay. We're gonna get there together. I'm gonna bring you one money story from a financial grownup, one lesson, and then my take on how you can make it your own. We got this.

Bobbi Rebell:
That was Women's Blogging Network BlogHer co-founder, Elisa Camahort Page, talking about the early days of that company. How many of us could go two full years without any cash coming in? Wow. Hello, Financial Grownup friends. Welcome to our newest listeners, and thank you for checking out the podcast. We keep shows to about 15 minutes because you're busy, but feel free to stack a few episodes together if you have a little more time.

Bobbi Rebell:
All right. Now to our inspiring guest. Elisa Camahort Page made a career switch to be part of the Silicon Valley boom, and was rising through the ranks. She saw a lot of big spenders there, but as you will hear, she escaped many of the pitfalls of her dot com peers. And it is only because of that, because of living below her means, that she was able to create her own company after the bust, global women's media empire BlogHer, which won countless accolades, including being named among the most powerful women entrepreneurs by Fortune, the most powerful people in new media by Forbes, and the most influential women in technology by Fast Company. By the way, she also won the Vanguard Award by Mom 2.0 summit, Iris Award. And for anyone that's gonna be down in Austin for Mom 2.0 this year in April, please come say hello. I will be down there as a speaker, and I'm very much looking forward to that.

Bobbi Rebell:
Back to Elisa. She later sold the company to SheKnows Media, and recently embarked on a career as a consultant, speaker, and author. Her book is Roadmap for Revolutionaries. Here is Elisa Camahort Page.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey, Elisa Camahort Page. You're a financial grownup. Welcome to the podcast.

Elisa Camahort:
Thank you so much for having me, Bobbi.

Bobbi Rebell:
Many people know you as the founder of BlogHer, which set all kinds of high standards for women's organizations and blogging. You were named as a social media legend, by the way, by the C Suite Network, top women in media by Folio. I could go on and on. And also, by the way, BlogHer, you guys were named most powerful women entrepreneurs by Fortune. You sold that to SheKnows Media, and stayed with the company for a little bit, but now you are a consultant and a speaker. You are also the author of the book Roadmap for Revolutionaries. So, welcome.

Elisa Camahort:
Thank you. Thank you so much for having me. I'm excited to talk today.

Bobbi Rebell:
Well, you started your journey back in the late '90s in Silicon Valley. At that time, you made a critical decision that we're gonna talk about as your money story. Then we're gonna come back, by the way, and talk more about you. But I want to hear your money story, because it has to do with a conservative financial move that you made, at a time when the dot com boom was really becoming a lifestyle, and something that was really consuming everyone around you, but you took a different tactic. Tell us your money story, Elisa.

Elisa Camahort:
Well, as I started going up the ladder and making more and more money, I did not spend like I was going up the ladder and making more and more money. I decided to really devote myself to my career at that point, because I had this goal. I wanted to buy a house or a condo. I just really focused on that. And sure enough I was able, by myself, to buy a condo. And what happened is, when the boom ended, and we started with the bust, and it started spiraling down ... And it was kind of a long, slow, uncomfortable spiral down ... I had a lot of friends who were really married to their mortgage, and they were really stuck. Because when times are really great, and banks were willing to give you big loans, I stayed really conservative, and I got a place that was appropriate for me, someone living alone, and ultimately with a partner. I didn't go hog wild.

Elisa Camahort:
A lot of my friends, when the bust happened, they were married to jobs that they felt miserable in, because they had this big mortgage. Whereas I, I had sort of the opposite experience. Which is in 2003, the nadir of the bust, and my company was going through like its eighth layoff in two years, and I thought, "It's gotta be me. Like, I have got to be laid off at this point. There is hardly anyone left."

Elisa Camahort:
Friday came and went, and layoffs happened, and I didn't get laid off. I sat there, and I spent all weekend being depressed, thinking, "Oh my God. I have to go back. It's gonna be such a graveyard. It's gonna be so much more work, and no more people to do it. I have to go back. That's so sad." And then I had this little voice in my head that said, "Why? Why do you have to go back?" Because I had been smart. I had bought my condo, and then I had gone right back into conserving and hoarding my money. I had about two years' worth of take home pay in the bank at that point, and so I walked in on Monday and said, "How do I get on the list?"

Elisa Camahort:
The other thing that allowed me to do, besides having my walk away money, was a year later, when I met my co-founders of BlogHer, and we decided to go after that, we didn't take a salary for two years. So, I had put myself in a position to really pursue my dreams. One dream was the condo. One dream was the company. But I really believe that you should think about your spending and saving now, like you have that big idea you want to pursue, even if you don't know what it is. Just think about when it hits you, being ready.

Bobbi Rebell:
It's really about keeping your overhead low, so you have that financial flexibility.

Elisa Camahort:
Yeah. Absolutely. I had a lot of options, because I maybe wasn't as ... I wasn't as high spending, and wasn't going out and doing some of the things that looked kind of fun, and they would have been fun. I just found other ways, and really focused on wanting to have that cushion for myself, because who knows what I would want to do next?

Bobbi Rebell:
So, give me an example. Do you remember any times when other people were doing things that you really couldn't do because you wanted to keep that overhead low, and have this giant cushion? I mean, two years, when you're so young, is a lot of financial runway there.

Elisa Camahort:
I think a lot of it was about, what do I spend my money on? And I presaged the millennials, because I tended to spend my money on getting together with friends, experiences. You know, I would go out to eat more than I would buy things. I wasn't necessarily out there getting that upgraded bag, or lots of clothes. And certainly I still shop. I have always liked shopping. Oh, Ann Taylor Loft. That's the perfect store for me, you know? That's just not where my interests lied, to want to spend a lot of money.

Elisa Camahort:
The other thing is, I do travel more now than I used to. I think it's good. Travel is obviously super expanding for your mind and your heart and your soul, and so I do think travel is important. That has been sort of a slow increase, in investing in those experiences. But until that point, most of it was experiences that were pretty moderately priced and pretty close to home, and pretty involving friends, as well. Which I think was another reason that made me not miss the stuff I wasn't acquiring, because what I was doing was sort of enriching my circle and my network and my friendships.

Bobbi Rebell:
And you were busy. So, what is the takeaway for our listeners here?

Elisa Camahort:
Well, the takeaway is that money doesn't buy happiness, up to a certain point. I mean, yes. Once you have your basic needs met, you're happier. But, money doesn't buy happiness. What it buys you is freedom, and it buys you the freedom to do a lot more than you might be thinking about. And I don't know that when I was saving money to buy a house, I was thinking about saving money to start a company. Luckily, that came in handy for me. So, money doesn't buy you happiness, but it does buy you freedom.

Bobbi Rebell:
All right. Let's move to your everyday money tip, which has to do with the value of mentoring, and how that translates into financial success in the long run. I mean, it really goes to what you were saying before. You talk about playing the long game, even if you don't know what the long game is yet. That's kind of what you were just getting at, is have the money even before you figure out what you need it for. Because you didn't envision BlogHer when you were buying a house that was a lot less than what you could afford.

Elisa Camahort:
I learned, when I first got into tech, that first of all, I had multiple mentors. I didn't loo for one person to be the be-all end-all mentor. I had one guy who mentored me around technology issues. I had one guy who mentored me around business issues. And the one key thing he did for me, that really was a lesson, was that he let me sit in on calls and meetings that my position didn't require me to be there. He just sort of identified me as his protégé, and let me sit in. And all I did in most of those meetings and calls was listen, but I heard how he established relationships. I heard how he negotiated. I heard how those two things worked together, to get him what he wanted.

Elisa Camahort:
You know, a lot of people think about ... When they think about negotiation, they think about what they're gonna say, how they're gonna make their case, and it's very kind of me-focused. I really prefer to do a lot more listening, because it's only when you understand what core thing the person you're negotiating with, the core thing they really want, that's the way that you can find your way to having a mutually beneficial outcome to the negotiation. And I think that works on both sides of the hiring process, both sides of the negotiating and advancement process, and both sides of negotiating partnerships, and even M&A deals. So, I tend to be ... I'm kind of talkative in real life, like outside of a negotiation. But I listen more than I talk, so that I can figure out how to get to that core thing my other person across the table really wants. And then, giving me what I want is so much easier.

Bobbi Rebell:
Right. The information helps you get to the point where you know what they need to hear to make it happen, whatever your goal is.

Elisa Camahort:
Yeah. If you're more busy talking than listening in any negotiation, you're actually not gonna come out, I don't think, with the better end of the deal.

Bobbi Rebell:
Very well said, Elisa. All right. Let's talk about you, because you have now left your baby, BlogHer, which you had sold, and you are making a big impact in the world with your speaking and your book. Tell us more about what's going on with you.

Elisa Camahort:
Yeah, absolutely. I stayed after the acquisition for almost three years, but then it really was time to go. Part of it was because I wanted to work on some other projects, including my book, Roadmap for Revolutionaries, which is all about how we can all be better every day activists, and how we can be more effective, because we're all busy. I used to hate the term work-life balance, because I felt like no one ever asked men about it. But now I like the term work-life-activism balance, because I like to think about how can you integrate, into an already really busy life, how you want to make a difference in the world. The things you want to activate around, the things you're most passionate about. Finding a space for that in your life, I think makes us so much happier, because i think happiness is really tied to how well we live to our own value system, and how much we're able to do that.

Bobbi Rebell:
So true. All right. Where can everyone find out more about you, and where they can see you? Because you're very busy on the speaker circuit.

Elisa Camahort:
Yes. Well, my website is ElisaCP.com, and there is a tab there for all my speaking appearances. There's a tab there about my book, and about articles I write and the writing I'm doing. And then, I'm on the interwebs. Twitter @ElisaC, and Instagram ElisaCP, and most of my posts on Facebook are public. Just search my name.

Bobbi Rebell:
Awesome. Thank you so much.

Elisa Camahort:
Thank you, Bobbi.

Bobbi Rebell:
So much great stuff. Here we go. Financial grownup tip number one: Ask your boss if you can be in the room of meetings you may not officially be invited to join. It's okay to just say, "I want to learn from you. I want to observe." Think of it like auditing a class in school. Even if you don't have a specific business purpose there, ask if you can just be in the room, as I said. And then, just do that. Listen. Pay attention. Be a little invisible. I know there's a lot of talk about sitting at the table, speaking up, participating, and that's all good when you have a role at the meeting. But if you're there to observe, consider that a privilege, and make sure it doesn't take away from the work that you need to get done otherwise.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial grownup tip number two: Prepare for the long term, even if you don't have any big picture goals yet. Elisa wasn't saving to start a business. She did not see that in her future. But when opportunity presented itself, she had the money to go two years without income to make it happen, and it paid off.

Bobbi Rebell:
So, my friends, what is the best lesson you have learned from a mentor? I would love to hear from you. DM me on Instagram at BobbiRebell1, on Twitter @BobbiRebell, and you can email at hello@FinancialGrownup.com. And if you find value in this show, please take the time to think of a friend that might also enjoy it, and help us grow by encouraging them to check it out and subscribe. Big thanks to Elisa Camahort Page for her words of wisdom, a great story, and helping us all get one step closer to being financial grownups.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownup with Bobbi Rebell is edited and produced by Steve Stewart, and is a BRK Media production.

Millennial mompreneur Kelsey Larsen shares her story of taking her home-made bibs from Etsy to mass retail by reaching out to entrepreneurs she admired but did not know, for advice, and in one case, collaboration.

In Kelsey's money story you will learn:

• How this young mom started a company from a product she made to keep her son clean during mealtime

• How she started a business with a $99 dollar sewing machine and $20 in fabric

• How her first sale on Etsy launched her into full business mode and the things she had to learn along the way

• The importance asking questions even when you're nervous to do so

In Kelsey's money lesson you will learn:

• If you have an idea, just go for it

• If you aren't embarrassed by the first version of your product you've started too late

In Kelsey's everyday money tip you will learn:

• Realizing that at some point that you can't do it all

• The importance of finding and identifying people that are great with aspects of your business that you aren't so good at

In My Take you will learn:

• Why it's important to reach out boldly to people that you admire and can learn from

• Why you'll want to do some test marketing before going all in on your side hustle
  
  

Check out Kelsey's website -

BapronBaby.com

Follow Kelsey!

• Instagram - @BapronBaby

• Facebook - @BapronBaby

• Pinterest - @BapronBaby

Millennial mompreneur Kelsey Larsen shares her story of taking her home-made bibs from Etsy to mass retail by reaching out to entrepreneurs she admired but did not know, for advice, and in one case, collaboration. In this Financial Grownup podcast episode you’ll learn how you can take a side hustle and turn it into a successful business. #Entrepreneur #SideHustle

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.

Transcription

Kelsey Larsen:
I made the decision to really go all in. I made the investment. I bought 20,000 boxes for a product. I had not sold 20,000 Baprons at this point. I had not sold anywhere near 20,000 Baprons but I asked the awkward questions to people that I had no business talking with.

Bobbi Rebell:
You're listening to Financial Grownup with me, certified financial planner, Bobbi Rebell, author of How to Be a Financial Grownup, but you know what? Being a grown up is really hard, especially when it comes to money, but it's okay. We're going to get there together. I'm going to bring you one money story from a financial grownup, one lesson and then my take on how you can make it your own. We got this.

Bobbi Rebell:
That was entrepreneur, Kelsey Larsen of BapronBaby talking about jumping in big when she decided her hobby, making unique bibs that wrap around the baby, was going to be a lot more than a stay-at-home mom hobby.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hello, Financial Grownup friends and special welcome to our newest listeners. If you have a moment, I want to hear how you discovered the show and also any feedback or suggestions. DM me on Instagram @bobbirebell1, on Twitter @bobbirebell, or email hello@financialgrownup.com. As I said, suggestions, feedback, anything that can help me improve the show and grow the show, truly appreciated.

Bobbi Rebell:
Let's get to BapronBaby's Kelsey Larsen. The biggest of her story is really relatable but where she went and where she's going is pretty extraordinary and something that we can all learn from. There's so many decisions that she's made so far that really changed the course of where the company is going and that's affected her life and her business. Make sure you stay for our everyday money tip by the way. It is about a vision board, but it's not really the kind of vision board that you're used to. It's got a big twist that I think you guys are going to really get a lot from. Here is BapronBaby founder, Kelsey Larsen.

Bobbi Rebell:
Hey, Kelsey Larson. You're a financial grownup. Welcome to the podcast.

Kelsey Larsen:
Thanks, Bobbi. It's so good to be here.

Bobbi Rebell:
I'm excited to hear more about your business. You are the founder and the owner. We practiced saying the name because I kept messing it up. It's BapronBaby.

Kelsey Larsen:
BapronBaby. Yeah, it's got- [crosstalk 00:02:32]

Bobbi Rebell:
Which I do want to point out is self-funded and debt-free and you have really ... I mean, your main product are these, I wish they were around when my son was younger, these bibs that are basically for the babies that rip off the bibs and throw them to the side, which is pretty much, at least my kid, a lot of kids.

Kelsey Larsen:
Exactly. The company, I started because my son wouldn't wear bibs and I was getting so frustrated with how many of his outfits he was ruining.

Bobbi Rebell:
Yeah. Outfits, furniture, walls. So much can be ruined.

Kelsey Larsen:
All of the things.

Bobbi Rebell:
All of the things. And I want to talk to you about how this become "A real company," a real brand because you're now in everywhere from Buy Buy Baby, you're on Amazon, just everywhere that you would ... I think over a hundred boutiques in this country. If this started as a hobby though, how did you know this could be a brand? Tell us your money story.

Kelsey Larsen:
You know, it sort of started out a necessity. I was a young mom. I had quite my job in HR to stay home with my little boy and I was living the dream, but my husband's a police officer and we started looking through things and we were like wow, we need some additional income. I had made this product for my son. It was just something that I had created for him because I needed something that would cover his entire body when he was eating meal time and he was comfortable in it. A friend mentioned Etsy. I had never heard of it. I had never sold anything on it, for sure. And I just sort of made a listing. I took some pictures of a bib that my son ... It was a Bapron that my son had actually worn. It was kind of dirty. Just took a picture of it and say hey, I'll sell this to you for ... I think I said like ... My first one, I think I sold for $17.

Bobbi Rebell:
And you just made it at home. You had just made this yourself?

Kelsey Larsen:
I started this business. Honestly, I started everything that I have with a $99 Brother sewing machine and 20 bucks in fabric. It was just something I made in my living room.

Bobbi Rebell:
Wow. Okay. So, how did you go from ... Now, you start selling it on Etsy. What happens?

Kelsey Larsen:
My very first listing sold within 24 hours to someone I had never met, a stranger in Illinois. All of a sudden, I needed packaging. I needed to figure out how I was going to send this to her. I couldn't just send it.

Bobbi Rebell:
And you hadn't thought about that?

Kelsey Larsen:
No. No, I didn't think I was ever going to sell anything. So, I had a printer and I went online and I used Microsoft Paint to make myself a logo and write a few words about the product and printed it out and it was very homemade.

Bobbi Rebell:
So, that went on for about a year, the Etsy selling. Then, you made a decision to really turn this into a brand. What happened?

Kelsey Larsen:
From Etsy, I gained a little bit of confidence. I started realizing that this is a product that mothers and families need. Toddlers are really happy in it. They're comfortable and they're working. They're waterproof. They have everything that we need. So, I made the decision to really go all in. I made the investment. I bought 20,000 boxes for a product ... I had not sold 20,000 Baprons at this point. I had not sold anywhere near 20,000 Baprons but I asked the awkward questions to people I had no business talking with. The owner of EzPz, Lindsey Laurain, she ... I reached out to her. One email ... I think I sent her an email on Christmas Eve.

Bobbi Rebell:
Cold? You didn't know her at all?

Kelsey Larsen:
Oh no. No contact prior to it but I knew that she had been on Shark Tank and it was something I had been thinking about. So, I kind of angled it as like "Hey, I'm someone coming up the same path you did and I wanted some insight." It was Christmas Eve and she responded to me at like 11:00 at night within 20 minutes.

Bobbi Rebell:
Oh my gosh, wow.

Kelsey Larsen:
She was so quick to answer questions and so quick to give me her tips because she kind of did start the same way. Just a ... Like a mom who had a product that she needed to get out in the world. From there, I was able to awkwardly ask her the questions about "Hey, who makes packages? How do you find a company that does that?" Because when I Googled it, I couldn't really find much. So, a series of those awkward conversation where I asked someone who was successful already and- [crosstalk 00:06:36]

Bobbi Rebell:
And you were just cold calling these people? You were just emailing this people cold?

Kelsey Larsen:
Honestly, it was basically just sending a message on Instagram or finding an email address or just little things here and there. There were businesses that did not ever respond to me, but that's okay. I mean, not everybody has to give me the time of day. Just reaching out about very specific questions and little by little, I found contacts for manufacturing and then I found contacts for a team here in the United States who does the actual sewing of the product.

Bobbi Rebell:
And then how did you grow it? How did it become this bigger brand that's now in so many retailers?

Kelsey Larsen:
Instagram has been a wonderful wonderful tool and being able to connect with other mothers has been great. Word of mouth advertising is the most successful form of marketing and I never could have grown my business without customers taking my photos. I don't have a photo studio but we're still growing to Buy Buy Baby and we're in Nordstrom and we're on Amazon in these places that I never could have done on my own.

Bobbi Rebell:
So, wait. What happens is people take pictures of their own babies ... And do you prompt them to do that? Do you ask them to do that or did this just start happening?

Kelsey Larsen:
No. At first, I was just on Instagram trying to [huck 00:07:50] my product to the 12 followers that I had or something. That first customer that I told you about on Etsy, she had bought the Bapron specifically for her little girl's 11-month photo shoot. So, she just sent me pictures just saying like "Hey, look how cute your product is on my baby." I asked her if I could use that for my marketing and she absolutely goes "Yeah, that would be great." And from there, I started to find that people are pretty excited to have their photos out and so I would just reach out individuals who had taken their pictures in the past, say "Hey, if I send you a few products, can you take pictures for me?" Absolutely, they would and it's been a very slow organic growth and brand repping has been something that I've been really grateful for.

Bobbi Rebell:
So, it's really been organic authentic growth through social media.

Kelsey Larsen:
Yes. Along with that though, there was a lot of pacing myself, realizing that I can't do it all. I can't balance manufacturing on my own and marketing on my own and running my social media and taking care of my son and making sure that my family has the things that they need. I very quickly learned how important it was to recognize the things that I'm failing at. Maybe not failing, but that I just cannot fit in and get over the guilt of it, stop feeling bad that I can't do it all. There's a David Allen quote that says "You can do anything, but you can't do everything."

Bobbi Rebell:
All right. What is the lesson, the takeaway for our listeners from this story?

Kelsey Larsen:
If you think you're not ready but you have an idea, there is no harm in just doing it, just going for it. If you're not embarrassed by the first version of your product that you've launched, you've started to late. You'll find your success and you'll find what's working by putting it out in the marketplace, using your success as a test market and allowing yourself to organically grow.

Bobbi Rebell:
All right. Let's talk about your everyday money tip because it's something that a lot of us ... It has to do with, frankly, guilt that we feel because we can't do everything we feel we should and we don't want to let people down.

Kelsey Larsen:
So, I have a vision board. I actually have a physical vision board kind of like we did in middle school.

Bobbi Rebell:
Sure.

Kelsey Larsen:
I put pictures of things that I'm really good at or I will identify things that I need someone else to do. For example, I do not take good photos. I just don't. And my product and my brand, I mean on Instagram, everything has to look great. So, I've been able to find and identify people who are great at it who I can pay to handle that. Even if it's not money that you've got, talking with other women, other mothers, other business owners, people are really willing to help out other individuals who are trying.

Bobbi Rebell:
Kelsey, before I let you go, tell us where people can find out more about you and the company.

Kelsey Larsen:
Yeah. So, we do most of our sales on bapronbaby.com. We are on Amazon. We also ... As far as social media goes, Facebook, Pinterest, Instagram. It's just BapronBaby.

Bobbi Rebell:
And you're also in retailers, right?

Kelsey Larsen:
Yeah. So, local retailers throughout the country. We are in bundles with EzPz on Buy Buy Baby and in Nordstrom.

Bobbi Rebell:
Love it. Thank you so much, Kelsey.

Kelsey Larsen:
Yeah. It was great to be here. Thanks.

Bobbi Rebell:
All right, my friends. Let's get to it. Financial Grownup tip number one. Reach out boldly to people that you admire and can learn from. Be smart about it. Don't stalk anyone, okay? But there is nothing wrong with a few polite emails to someone that you admire. Flattery is a great strategy. You would be surprised how well it works and how few people actually do it. Maybe you're going to get a mentor like Kelsey did and that, in here case, got her into a top retailer for her product. You would be amazed at the kinds of things people will do if you connect with them and you bond with them and make a relationship. People really do want to help other people.

Bobbi Rebell:
Financial Grownup tip number two. If you have a side hustle and are considering going all in as Kelsey did, you gotta do some test marketing first before you go all in as she did. Let's not forget. Kelsey was selling Etsy for a year before she even tried to go big. So while her growth plan, once she was doing it, was pretty bold, it did have a really strong foundation.

Bobbi Rebell:
Finally, I want to thank you guys that have checked out my new podcast, Money in the Morning, with Joe Saul-Sehy. You may know him from his other podcast, Stacking Benjamins. So, Joe and I take a couple of news headlines and we share the lessons from it that we can all learn from and we come up with a big idea, a big takeaway that you can really take with you and hopefully make some positive changes in your financial life and your wellbeing and sometimes just overall happiness.

Bobbi Rebell:
Here's where it gets really interesting and really scary for me. We do it live. We do not cut anything out and we do it in front of you guys on camera on Facebook Live and if you want to be on the show, you can actually participate with your comments, which we integrate into the show. Go to Facebook.com/istackbenjamins. Set your alerts for when we go live. It's really easy to do that. We're working on a regular schedule but set the alerts for now. We would love to see you there. Check out the audio podcast as well, Money in the Morning. That is wherever you enjoy podcasts, just like this this.

Bobbi Rebell:
All right. Big thanks to Kelsey for sharing her story and for helping us all get one step closer to being financial grownups.

Ditch the coffee and forget the drinks meeting. Walking is a proven way to bring out the most creative ideas- and make the best connections with the people who can help you succeed. We talk how to set up walking meetings, how to generate ideas while walking, and how to keep walking when the weather foils your plans. 

Here are 5 Ways to Walk Your Way to Success

• Walk alone in silence

• Walk while listening to spoken audio

• Walk while listening to music

• Walk with a friend

• Walk for a business meeting

Episode Links:

• App for library books: Libby

• Nice piece in Readers Digest on the benefits of walking

• Erica Keswin Financial Grownup episode

• The Tim Ferriss Show podcast

• Charles Duhigg The Power of Habit audio book

• Tony Robbins Awaken The Giant Within book

• CNBC story on business leaders walking meetings - The meeting hack loved by CEOs at Google, Facebook and LinkedIn

• Stanford University study - Give Your Ideas Some Legs: The Positive Effect of Walking on Creative Thinking

• Richard Branson’s blog post Why You Should Stand Up In Meetings

Ditch the coffee and forget the drinks meeting. Walking is a proven way to bring out the most creative ideas- and make the best connections with the people who can help you succeed. We talk how to set up walking meetings, how to generate ideas while walking, and how to keep walking when the weather foils your plans. In this Financial Grownup podcast episode you’ll learn 5 different ways to walk your way to success. #SuccessTips #Walking

Some of the links in this post are affiliate links. This means if you click on the link and purchase the item, I will receive an affiliate commission at no extra cost to you. All opinions remain my own.